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93 3.1 no fuel


rmcracing
05-15-2008, 08:23 PM
I have a 93 Trans Sport with the 3.1 v-6. It's been parked for several years, but I go out and start it every once in awhile. Friend has totaled her van, and I wanted to give this one to her.

It cranks fine and it will run if I put some fuel in the in the TBI units barrels.

I think the fuel pump runs, but cant really tell. I hear something energizing up, but not sure if it's the fuel pump, or the ABS pump.

I checked and swapped the fuel pump relay with another one, and still no go.

I've checked the fuses and both the fuel pump and the ECM fuses are good.

I have power to the Orange wire at the relay, but I don't get power at the green/white wire when the key is on. I tried applying 12 volts to the gray wire with the key off to see if I could hear the fuel pump running, but could not hear it. I have not cracked the fuel lines at the TBI to see if there is fuel pressure, as it would only tell me if fuel gets there, it may not have enough pressure.

The injectors have power to them. It's not the original fuel pump. I've replaced it a couple of thousand miles ago.

Any suggestions on what to look for? I'd hate to have to drop the tank down to get at the fuel pump, since the van is parked on grass/mud:frown:

merc81
05-21-2008, 12:47 PM
Get a helper to listen at the tank when you turn the key on (don't try to start, just turn to run position). You will hear the pump for 2 sec. if its running. If no pump is heard, then you have several more options to test before pulling the pump out, but listen for it first. It may be the fuel filter is plugged after setting too long and the pump isn't the problem, or it may be many other things, but see if you can hear the pump before doing anything else.
John

rmcracing
05-22-2008, 07:58 PM
Well, I finally got it to start, but it wont keep running. I dropped the fuel filter and ran some low pressure air through it, and it shot fuel out. I turn the key to run while the filter was disconnected, and 2 seconds worth of fuel shot on the ground, then stopped. Cycled it a couple of times each with the same results. Connected the filter back up and cranked it a couple of times, then I could see fuel coming out of the injectors when cranking, then it started, but immediately died. It died while fuel was coming out of the injectors but may have slowed. You can see fuel coming out of the injectors in a spray pattern, for about 1 second before the engine fires. It goes to about 2,000 rpm, then just dies out. I can somewhat throttle it back and forth to get it to run a couple more seconds, but it doesnt seem to get the fuel it needs. So, I'm guessing that since it does not start right away, that its collecting some fuel in that first second or so, then when it fires, it's using the fuel already in the manifold in addition to the fuel being supplied. Once it burns the initial fuel, there is not enough being supplied to keep it going and dies out.

Any more thoughts?
Much appreciated.

LMP
05-25-2008, 05:10 PM
Any codes? Is the Check engine light ON?
It has been reported a failure with the cam sensor will inhibit fuel injectors from functioning after the initial primer but I do not see that on the diagram so I cannot confirm.
www.avigex.ca/xport/31fuelcontrol.jpg
ALso..the initial primer is with the fuel pump trigged from the relay..but once the engine runs, a switch part of the oil pressure sensor will keep the pump running, normally in addition to the relay....but I would check anyway for the pump being still fed with 12V after the engine cranks.

rmcracing
05-26-2008, 05:07 PM
Yes, there are trouble codes stored. Code 34 for MAP sensor, but I have had that stupid code in for years. Code 54 which is low fuel voltage. That was a new one. I cleared out the codes, and tried to start it again. It started like it has been, running for a couple of seconds, then dying out. The troubleshooting says to run for 30 seconds or until a code gets set. This is difficult to do, since it wants to die out. I kept feathering the pedal and got it to run until a code got set, but it was code 24 for vehicle speed sensor. It says I can ignore it, if I was sitting still..which I was.
There is no cam sensor on the 3.1, but there is on the 3.8.
On the DTC54 chart the diagnosis path says the code 54 is intermittent in my case and to refer to Intermittents in Symptoms section "B". I have no idea of where that section is. Lower on the chart there is another diagnosis path talking about the oil pressure switch. The test is to probe furel pump test terminal witha test terminial with a test light to ground. I cannot find the fuel pump test terminal. I have seen in places that its supposed to be behind the battery by the strut tower. I cannot seem to find it. Does anyone know what it looks like? One wire? A capped off plug? What color is the wire? Anyone got a picture of one?
I am able to get it to run about the same with the fuel pump relay totally disconnected. This would be like the test of disconnecting the fuel pump relay after it starts. It takes a little longer to start, since it does not the get prime, but it will start, then act like it does and die out after a few seconds.
Any help is most appreciated.

LMP
05-29-2008, 05:39 AM
WIth my 3.8, the fuel pump test terminal shows as a red wire going nowhere at hte passenger side of enfine.

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