please i really want /need some educated opioion on my mods


zr800efi
04-27-2008, 11:38 PM
hello everybody , im fairly new here and hoping for some advice /knowledge on my cars current and upcoming mods and what bearing on performance can i hope to acheive . i already have ; greddy evo two catback and 4-2-1 hedder , short ram intake system with heatshield , neuspeed short throw shift kit , 17 ince /215/40 tires and chrome rims . can someone please give an educated view on what hp gains my mods will have on my b18b , non veetech 1.8 dohc engine [which is stock 140 hp at crank .) note that around my neck of the woods a whell dyno is non existent , so a crank hp estimated guess would be certainly appriciated.:cool:

part 2 of this equasion is as follows';

my block is now being sent for a boring of 60 over , pistons are going forged , re inforced valve train , heads are being ported and polished , timing key and trick cam gears .....along with my bolt on mods , what can i expect in the way of hp and tourque gains ? ive heard around 160 crank hp, to upwards of 190 crank hp .which of these claims would u think to be most accurate and if neither , please give me your opioion . thanks so much for your time ,.

Greenblurr93
04-28-2008, 02:14 PM
So you basically have an exhaust a hot air intake and some heavy ass rims... i wouldnt expect your car to be any faster than stock to be honest.

As it stand id put your car at about 145CHP. after the machine work maybe 155CHP.. your increasing displacement which makes the combustion chamber larger, so unless you got higher compression pistons to compensate, your basically lowering compression...

from the sounds of it, you arent very knowlegable about your car other than what people tell you, I suggest doing some research because i think you couldve taken the money spent on machine work and spent it elsewhere and had a more powerful car

zr800efi
04-28-2008, 04:30 PM
So you basically have an exhaust a hot air intake and some heavy ass rims... i wouldnt expect your car to be any faster than stock to be honest.

As it stand id put your car at about 145CHP. after the machine work maybe 155CHP.. your increasing displacement which makes the combustion chamber larger, so unless you got higher compression pistons to compensate, your basically lowering compression...

from the sounds of it, you arent very knowlegable about your car other than what people tell you, I suggest doing some research because i think you couldve taken the money spent on machine work and spent it elsewhere and had a more powerful car


ok , first off its a cold air intake system , the shield prevents unwanted heat from engine side of the intake filter , not trap it {i asked fer knowledable info , not hot air from ignorant statements such as that } my rims are not even as heavy as my stock 15s , and last i checked a hedder and intake/full catback exhaust do add a bit more than 5 hp . im obviously increasing bore size and using forged dome pistons as well as porting to the head as stated above . obviously this will bring up compression [y the fuck would i bore out the block if i wasnt going 60 over on the piston size as well?] of course its going to be higher compression over stock , not lower .....and im not very knowledgable?lol.wow man , i hope your not the best this site has to offer .....but thanks fer your opinion , no matter how uneducated it was . but if nothing else , it was entertaining . let me guess, your 16 or something right??lol, later buddy .

Greenblurr93
04-28-2008, 04:53 PM
Watch the way you address some people here 'buddy'. you wanted an opinion and you got one, sorry it wasnt the one youre looking for. And you never stated you were getting oversized pistons, all you said was 'forged'. and i hope you dont believe those claims of HP gain that the company's give, there are many ways to fake a dyno sheet and i promise you, you wont get anywhere near what the companies claim. And did you state they were lightweight rims? NO, the fact is 99% of 'chrome' rims are quite a bit heavier than stock. ANd you also stated a 'short ram' which does suck in hot air from the engine bay, does the sheild help? a little. But please taka a pyrometer and measure the air around the intake filter, it will be quite a bit hotter than if you had a true cold air system sucking air from the fender

Not my fault you were vague and i did the best could with what little info you gave.

eckoman_pdx
04-29-2008, 01:31 AM
zr800efi, Do Not curse here. That kind of language is inappropriate and is not tolerated here @ AF. Please watch your mouth. Also, please refrain from insulting members. If you have issue, take it to PM Land.

Now, as for your questions...

You have a Short Ram intake, not a Cold Air Intake (CAI). The intake pipe on a CAI goes outside of the engine bay and relocated the air filter into the wheel well in front of the wheel, where it pulls in colder air from outside the hotter engine bay. You have a Short Ram Intake with a heat shield. Yes, the heat shield helps keep heat away from the filter, but it is NOT a Cold Air Intake. They are different. To be a CAI it HAS to relocate the filter to outside of the engine bay where it pulls in colder air from the wheel well.

As for the Oversized Pistons, what is the Compression Ratio of the Pistons you are putting in. What size are you boring the block to/what is the size of the pistons?If your goal is to stay N/A with a B18B1, you should consider an LS/Vtec. A non-vtec B18B1 is a great base for a turbo motor. With all the head and blockwork you're doing plus the cam gears, if you're staying N/A (which is sounds like you are), you'd get more bang for your buck with an LS/Vtec. Either way, if you are really wanting to get the most you can out of your block and headwork, you really should have the motor dyno tuned. Hondata and Crome are both good and budget friendly choices. I know you said a dyno is almost non-existent, but it's the truth.

Also, what kind of 4-2-1 header is it? I have seen independent Dyno charts from header shootouts, all headers on the same motor. DC Sports headers made no more power than stock. In fact, the DC 4-2-1 had less power than OEM peak, although it was higher on some area's under the curve. Greddy's 4-2-1 and Ebelbrocks 4-2-1 are more spendy, but they actually did have gains. About 3-4 hp peak, with more under certain areas of the curve.

Your Short Ram Intake may yield a few hp, but you'd be better off with a CAI, as it'll get you a few more. For every 11.1 degrees you lower the intake temp, you get a 1% gain in HP. So if it's 150 degrees under the hood and 90 outside, you'd see approximately a 5.5% hp gain with a CAI.

Overall, a CAI/Header/Exhaust might yield about 5hp each, for a total of 15hp. About 5hp from a CAI, 4 or so from a Greddy/Ebelbrock Header, 5-7 from a good exhaust. Not all parts are equal, so if you threw something like DC on there, your gains will be less.

Also, since you listed y wheels and tires. Wheels and tires don't matter for crank HP. The 215's will give you better grip than stock tire sizes, if the wheels are heavier wheels they will slow you down, but they don't affect HP. I've read that every 1lb of rotating mass you add or loose is equal to 8 lbs stagnant weight. Also, you have 215/40/17? 205/40/17 is a better tire size, in terms of closer to the proper circumference so it'll throw off the speedo less.

zr800efi
04-29-2008, 10:44 AM
Watch the way you address some people here 'buddy'. you wanted an opinion and you got one, sorry it wasnt the one youre looking for. And you never stated you were getting oversized pistons, all you said was 'forged'. and i hope you dont believe those claims of HP gain that the company's give, there are many ways to fake a dyno sheet and i promise you, you wont get anywhere near what the companies claim. And did you state they were lightweight rims? NO, the fact is 99% of 'chrome' rims are quite a bit heavier than stock. ANd you also stated a 'short ram' which does suck in hot air from the engine bay, does the sheild help? a little. But please taka a pyrometer and measure the air around the intake filter, it will be quite a bit hotter than if you had a true cold air system sucking air from the fender

Not my fault you were vague and i did the best could with what little info you gave.

ok , my bad on the explanation . i just assumed when i said i was going 60 over that it would be a given that the piston size anyone would put in a bored out block would match the new bore size . i know enough not to believe the companies word , those were just some numbers thrown out there by some guys i talked to . the rims i have are ten spoke chrome with very thin spokes .apparently there not supposed to weigh more than my stock wheels ......again , shoulda made a cleareer statement about some of the gear i bought .i took what u said as a attack on my intelligence when u said "your not very knowledgable". i was asking fer some info cause i dont claim to be a mechanical genious.so i kinda thought that was a bit uncalled for .but if it offended u , sorry .

zr800efi
04-29-2008, 10:57 AM
zr800efi, Do Not curse here. That kind of language is inappropriate and is not tolerated here @ AF. Please watch your mouth. Also, please refrain from insulting members. If you have issue, take it to PM Land.

Now, as for your questions...

You have a Short Ram intake, not a Cold Air Intake (CAI). The intake pipe on a CAI goes outside of the engine bay and relocated the air filter into the wheel well in front of the wheel, where it pulls in colder air from outside the hotter engine bay. You have a Short Ram Intake with a heat shield. Yes, the heat shield helps keep heat away from the filter, but it is NOT a Cold Air Intake. They are different. To be a CAI it HAS to relocate the filter to outside of the engine bay where it pulls in colder air from the wheel well.

As for the Oversized Pistons, what is the Compression Ratio of the Pistons you are putting in. What size are you boring the block to/what is the size of the pistons?If your goal is to stay N/A with a B18B1, you should consider an LS/Vtec. A non-vtec B18B1 is a great base for a turbo motor. With all the head and blockwork you're doing plus the cam gears, if you're staying N/A (which is sounds like you are), you'd get more bang for your buck with an LS/Vtec. Either way, if you are really wanting to get the most you can out of your block and headwork, you really should have the motor dyno tuned. Hondata and Crome are both good and budget friendly choices. I know you said a dyno is almost non-existent, but it's the truth.

Also, what kind of 4-2-1 header is it? I have seen independent Dyno charts from header shootouts, all headers on the same motor. DC Sports headers made no more power than stock. In fact, the DC 4-2-1 had less power than OEM peak, although it was higher on some area's under the curve. Greddy's 4-2-1 and Ebelbrocks 4-2-1 are more spendy, but they actually did have gains. About 3-4 hp peak, with more under certain areas of the curve.

Your Short Ram Intake may yield a few hp, but you'd be better off with a CAI, as it'll get you a few more. For every 11.1 degrees you lower the intake temp, you get a 1% gain in HP. So if it's 150 degrees under the hood and 90 outside, you'd see approximately a 5.5% hp gain with a CAI.

Overall, a CAI/Header/Exhaust might yield about 5hp each, for a total of 15hp. About 5hp from a CAI, 4 or so from a Greddy/Ebelbrock Header, 5-7 from a good exhaust. Not all parts are equal, so if you threw something like DC on there, your gains will be less.

Also, since you listed y wheels and tires. Wheels and tires don't matter for crank HP. The 215's will give you better grip than stock tire sizes, if the wheels are heavier wheels they will slow you down, but they don't affect HP. I've read that every 1lb of rotating mass you add or loose is equal to 8 lbs stagnant weight. Also, you have 215/40/17? 205/40/17 is a better tire size, in terms of closer to the proper circumference so it'll throw off the speedo less.


i appollogize for the cursing .but the way i took it the first member was a bit insulting towards me and that is the only reason i took that tone . like stated earlier , i appollogize for insulting you . thats not why i came to this site . the above info you stated sir is what i was looking for , thank you .


the hedder i a have is a greddy evo 2 421 hedder with the matching evo 2 cat back exhaust . the intake is the k and n typhoon . so hopefully i made a goog call on my brands .


i am aware tire size was no affect on crank hp lol. i was just listing all the mods .the reason i went 215 as opposed to 205 is the roads this year are brutal up here and very easy to bend a rim , so i went with a bit higher of profile on the rubber with hopes of having a little better chance of saving em [the rims] .


the ls vtech , are u talking about a b18b block with a gsr /sir head?? or is it a b18b mated to forced induction??thanks for your time sir and again , sorry fer the impression i first gave .

zr800efi
04-29-2008, 11:02 AM
zr800efi, Do Not curse here. That kind of language is inappropriate and is not tolerated here @ AF. Please watch your mouth. Also, please refrain from insulting members. If you have issue, take it to PM Land.

Now, as for your questions...

You have a Short Ram intake, not a Cold Air Intake (CAI). The intake pipe on a CAI goes outside of the engine bay and relocated the air filter into the wheel well in front of the wheel, where it pulls in colder air from outside the hotter engine bay. You have a Short Ram Intake with a heat shield. Yes, the heat shield helps keep heat away from the filter, but it is NOT a Cold Air Intake. They are different. To be a CAI it HAS to relocate the filter to outside of the engine bay where it pulls in colder air from the wheel well.

As for the Oversized Pistons, what is the Compression Ratio of the Pistons you are putting in. What size are you boring the block to/what is the size of the pistons?If your goal is to stay N/A with a B18B1, you should consider an LS/Vtec. A non-vtec B18B1 is a great base for a turbo motor. With all the head and blockwork you're doing plus the cam gears, if you're staying N/A (which is sounds like you are), you'd get more bang for your buck with an LS/Vtec. Either way, if you are really wanting to get the most you can out of your block and headwork, you really should have the motor dyno tuned. Hondata and Crome are both good and budget friendly choices. I know you said a dyno is almost non-existent, but it's the truth.

Also, what kind of 4-2-1 header is it? I have seen independent Dyno charts from header shootouts, all headers on the same motor. DC Sports headers made no more power than stock. In fact, the DC 4-2-1 had less power than OEM peak, although it was higher on some area's under the curve. Greddy's 4-2-1 and Ebelbrocks 4-2-1 are more spendy, but they actually did have gains. About 3-4 hp peak, with more under certain areas of the curve.

Your Short Ram Intake may yield a few hp, but you'd be better off with a CAI, as it'll get you a few more. For every 11.1 degrees you lower the intake temp, you get a 1% gain in HP. So if it's 150 degrees under the hood and 90 outside, you'd see approximately a 5.5% hp gain with a CAI.

Overall, a CAI/Header/Exhaust might yield about 5hp each, for a total of 15hp. About 5hp from a CAI, 4 or so from a Greddy/Ebelbrock Header, 5-7 from a good exhaust. Not all parts are equal, so if you threw something like DC on there, your gains will be less.

Also, since you listed y wheels and tires. Wheels and tires don't matter for crank HP. The 215's will give you better grip than stock tire sizes, if the wheels are heavier wheels they will slow you down, but they don't affect HP. I've read that every 1lb of rotating mass you add or loose is equal to 8 lbs stagnant weight. Also, you have 215/40/17? 205/40/17 is a better tire size, in terms of closer to the proper circumference so it'll throw off the speedo less.


i appollogize for the cursing .but the way i took it the first member was a bit insulting towards me and that is the only reason i took that tone . like stated earlier , i appollogize for insulting you . thats not why i came to this site . the above info you stated sir is what i was looking for , thank you .


the hedder i a have is a greddy evo 2 421 hedder with the matching evo 2 cat back exhaust . the intake is the k and n typhoon . so hopefully i made a goog call on my brands .


i am aware tire size was no affect on crank hp lol. i was just listing all the mods .the reason i went 215 as opposed to 205 is the roads this year are brutal up here and very easy to bend a rim , so i went with a bit higher of profile on the rubber with hopes of having a little better chance of saving em [the rims] .


the ls vtech , are u talking about a b18b block with a gsr /sir head?? or is it a b18b mated to forced induction??thanks for your time sir and again , sorry fer the impression i first gave .

Greenblurr93
04-29-2008, 12:20 PM
You took me using the word "knowlegable" in the wrong way, its like me giving advice on an eclispe... im not familiar with them, so im not 'knowlegable' toward them... thats what i meant by it. sorry for the confusion on that.

and the 215 doesnt really mean tire thickness that has more to do with width. the second number is the aspect ratio which will change with tire width... but generally the larger the number, the thicker the sidewall will be.

And yes, the term "LS/VTEC" refers to mating a vtec head (GSR/R) to an LS block. and when done correctly can yeild some good gains and be just as reliable.

eckoman_pdx
04-29-2008, 04:48 PM
Greenblurr93, he went with 215/40/17 over 205/40/17 since the 215/40/17 will give a thicker sidewall, due to the fact the "40" represents the sidewall being 40% on the thread width. So 215/40 gives him a little more sidewall than 205/40, which is what he wanted.

zr800efi, no worries, we all make mistakes. Welcome to the Board!!!:)

Greddy does make some of the better header out there for B-series motors. Their 4-2-1 one piece headers are very good. As I said, they give about 3-4hp peak gain, but there's a spot under the curve down low where it picked up 10hp over my stock LS manifold. DC Sports is over-rated crap, the 4-2-1 looses peak power, and their 4-1 is eqaul to stock, it just shifts the power band 1000 rpm higher. Props for doing the re-search and not picking DC. The Greddy 4-2-1 one piece is a good choice as far as headers go, that's what I have. Greddy does make decent exhaust too, so that's not a bad pick up. K & N does make darn good filter, I can't knock the choice of a K & N cone filter. I do prefer the CAI over a short ram for the reasons I stated above, but as far as short rams go, K & N isn't a bad pick-up if you're willing to spring for it. One of the benefits of a short ram though is you don't have to worry about hydrolock. I live in a wet area and have never screwed up mine, but with the filter in the wheel well like it is with a CAI, you have to be more careful in the rain to avoid puddles, because if the filter gets submerged you can hydrolock the motor. Basically, drive smart and your ok. With a short-ram through, you don't have to worry about that. My guesstimate is you picked up about 4 or so peak from the Greddy Header, 5-7 with the exhaust, and 2.5 with the intake. So I'd figure 11.5-13.5hp is a decent number to expect to have picked up. A good CAI might have put the number around 15hp total.

As for LS/vtec, that is a B18B1/A1 block with a GSR, B16A or Type-R head. Basically an LS block with a B-series Vtec head. After you do an LS/Vtec, you can go N/A or boost it, just as a regular motor.

A B18B1 mated to forced induction is just that: B18B1 block and head with a turbo or supercharger. If you wanted an LS/Vtec forced induction, you'd have to use the LS block, Vtec head and then turbo it.

Are you planning to stay N/A? What are your end goals for the car?

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