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E92 M3 v.s. C63 AMG


Germanophile
03-10-2008, 03:20 AM
Is there anyway to make the C63 handle like a BMW M3 would?

I'm losing sleep over my decision to buy the C63. Here in Australia, Mercedes have pulled out all the stops with the C63. The price is just under $150,000 compared to the M3 DSG version which costs over $180,000.

I have always been a big BMW fan. I love the crisp changes of direction and throttle control their cars are famous for and I've never liked the more "lazy" behaviour most Mercedes exhibit. My previous car was an E46 M3 and I loved it. But this time, with no evidence to prove anything has changed, I've made a switch to Mercedes. Partly it's due to the price. Partly it's due to the engine.

But after watching Top Gear and Fifth Gear comparisons on the 2 cars, I'm wavering. What's the point of going 0.1 seconds faster to 62mph if the car just isn't fun to drive? So I've been thinking. If i put the $32,500 i saved by buying a C63 towards modifications like making the car lighter, carbon ceramic brakes and changing the suspension set up, can i make the C63 handle like what i would expect from an M3?

Moppie
03-10-2008, 04:37 AM
If you ever get a BMW and Merc up on a hoist together, and have a look underneath, you soon realise that they both take very different approaches to suspension design.

BMW designs the handling they are famous for into the car before it is even built, Merc do the same thing with their ride comfort.

To change one, to make it like the other, is simply not possible with out making compromises.


Thats not to say you can't make an AMG handle extremely well, there is on reason you can not give it the same sort of cornering performance as an M3, it's just that it will never feel, or behave like an M3. The steering will always be a little softer and little vague, and over coming aspects of the suspension geometry designed for comfort will mean sacrificing that comfort and possibly ending up with a harsher ride than M3.


If you want an M3, buy an M3.
Otherwise learn to enjoy the AMG, you never know, it might grow on you.

(now sit back and watch while lots of people tell you to buy spring kits, and wheels, and tyres, and new shocks................)

silentscreams85
03-10-2008, 11:08 AM
:1:
bmw is a "driver's" car. the suspension being tuned to let the driver feel the little imprefections in the road, but giving a sense of command. this is at the cost however of road comfort
mb is definitely more of a cruiser. driver and passenger comfort are top prioroty and the suspension is smooth as silk. this compromises the driver's connection to the road in some ways.
both are great in their own ways, its just a matter of preference.

Germanophile
03-10-2008, 09:00 PM
I just called my dealer yesterday. My car's coming mid June. So they've started building it already. I'm not about to forfeit my deposit so i have no choice but to stick to the AMG.

I don't get my licence back till early July. I was thinking i should use the 2-3 weeks after i get the car to install a carbon-fibre roof.

I've never had a use for a sunroof. That should reduce the weight and lower the centre of gravity right? The M3 comes with a carbon fibre roof standard.

Moppie
03-11-2008, 01:18 AM
I just called my dealer yesterday. My car's coming mid June. So they've started building it already. I'm not about to forfeit my deposit so i have no choice but to stick to the AMG.

I don't get my licence back till early July. I was thinking i should use the 2-3 weeks after i get the car to install a carbon-fibre roof.

I've never had a use for a sunroof. That should reduce the weight and lower the centre of gravity right? The M3 comes with a carbon fibre roof standard.

Me thinks you have to much money. Tell you what, send me the AMG when it arrives (just throw it over the ditch) and I will drive it, and tune it for you, then send it back.

A carbon fiber roof will make no difference you will be able to feel.
Wait until the car gets here, then drive it, then decide if you need to do anything to it.
AMG tickle the suspension as much as the tickle the engine, you might be surprised.
And while it won't be an M3, I'm betting it will be more than fast enough.

Polygon
03-11-2008, 01:42 PM
Another excellent post from Moppie. I couldn't agree more.

DinanM3_S2
03-11-2008, 11:18 PM
What Moppie said.

You can indeed get aftermarket parts for the AMG Benz that can give it the same or better handling numbers as the M3, but ultimately you will not get the same feeling in the Mercedes Benz. Supposedly the E92 feels a little more disconnected then the E46, E36, or E30, so you may not be losing much going to the Benz. Both are good cars and I wouldn't be surprised if the Mercedes was a little easier to live with given its softer ride.

Germanophile
03-12-2008, 09:45 PM
Thanks for the honest advice. I guess i'll invest the money for a while and have more to tinker with the car later after i've driven it for a while.

But i have to wonder, every report i've read says the C63 is the first AMG car where the engine's power and torque doesn't feel like it's too much for the chasis. So why is it that the Stig and Tiff Needel still can't hit the apex of corners consistently?

The thing i loved most about my E46 was how precise the steering and throttle inputs were. You could place that car so accurately and it corners like it's on rails. Is that just not doable with a Merc?

Anyway, Grand Prix this weekend. Very excited. Too bad i won't get to hear Martin Brundle and James Allen. I always hate the Australian GP because i'm stuck listening to our own Australian commentators who are crap.

Moppie
03-13-2008, 02:34 AM
Because the Stig and Tiff and working on car shows laced with more opinion that fact. A bit like car forums, but they get paid for it.
They are also comparing the cars in a relative environment.

Compared to an M3 the AMG might be a little off the pace, but how does it compare to a Toyota Camry?

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