I noticed that my 1997 Camry CE was running hot when I was on the highway, especially when I was climbing a hill. Not in the red, but about half way to it from normal. It would cool back down after the hill, but still ran a bit warm on the highway. On other 'minor' roads, around town and what not, the temperature stayed within the normal range. Most of my driving is done on the highway BTW. Around 100 miles a day round trip.

I noticed that if I took the vehicle out of overdrive while climbing the hill it would bring the temperature down. Almost to the normal position, but not quite. I told my mechanic about it and he said that it sounded like a blown head gasket, but other than the vehicle running warm there were no other symptoms of this. I searched around and found that it could be anything from a bad thermostat, a radiator cap, head gasket ......blah, blah, blah.

About a week and a half ago I was climbing a hill on my way to work, running above normal temperature as always and I noticed that dreaded antifreeze smell. To make a long story short, it was the heater core. I had to have the car towed to my mechanic where he replaced the core. I asked if he thought we should replace the thermostat at that time and he said no, your thermostat is fine. How he could know this without doing a hot water test was beyond me, but he insisted that wasn't my problem. I was hoping that my whole problem was the heater core to begin with, maybe clogged, my heat never was the best anyway, but when I was driving home that day it did the same exact thing, ran hot going up hills and above normal at highway speed.

I did a bit more research and everything I found pointed to a bad thermostat. Being the easiest and cheapest thing to fix I brought it back to my mechanic and insisted that he change it, which he did.

Well, that was it. The car ran spot on normal temp. Up hills, down hills, high speed, low speed.......perfect!
So you would think.

Yesterday on my way home from work I stopped at a light and all of a sudden a plume of steam started coming out from under my hood. I pulled into a gas station, opened the hood and after a bit of looking around, trying to figure out where it was coming from. Mind you, the car was running fine for 3 full days with no incidents. I ended up finding a crack across the top of the radiator about 6-8 inches long. There was antifreeze all over. WTF? When I first noticed the steam I immediately looked at my temp gauge and it was 100% normal. When I got back in the car it was still at normal. Being that it wasn't overheating I was able to get it to my mechanic. He was able to get a radiator on the spot and he put it in. I should mention here that the radiator he took out was only about 2 years old, if that. He put it all back together and we ran it for over an hour. I took it for a ride, we idled it, we revved it up in the lot......all of it. The car runs 100% normal. No overheating, no oil to water, no water to oil, no bubbles in the expansion tank, no seemingly high pressure in the hoses....nothing.

My contention is, if there were high pressure in the radiator wouldn't the cap have blown into the expansion tank before splitting the rad? The level stayed normal BTW. It seems to me that there are weaker points that would go before the rad. We replaced the cap BTW when we put the new radiator.

I drove the car home, about 60 miles and it ran fine. I stopped 3 times on the way to check everything out. All seems fine. No overheating, no overflow in expansion tank, no bubbles in exp tank and no seemingly high pressure in the hoses. I do notice that the lower hose stays very cold though, most of the time. My mechanic said that although that's not necessarily normal it may be normal for my particular car. The operating temp could not be better. It's as if the temp gauge needle is glued in place. It never moves from normal.

Well there you have it. I know this post is long, but I wanted to give all the details.
Could this be an underlying problem ie; head gasket, or just bad luck?
Any suggestions would be appreciated. I know I'm new here and only found this place through Google.
I've had a lot of experience with Toyota vehicles and hopefully I can help some of you guys out one day as well.
Foe now I'm going to bounce around this lovely place and see if I can expand my knowledge of Toyota vehicles.


BTW, the above mentioned vehicle is a 1997 Camry CE with 343,000 original miles.

The cold lower hose may mean you need a water pump. They can corrode to the point that they are not circulating as well as they should, causing high-speed overheating and other strange symptoms. Consider when was you last put in a water pump. Also, have you ever run it for any length of time with insufficient antifreeze level in your coolant (e.g., 20% ethylene glycol instead of 50%)? That would allow your water pump to corrode.

Also, if they are old, you should consider replacing the radiator hoses. They (particulalry the bottom hose) are a potential source of mysterious cooling system problems. It can collapse internally and cause a problem with suction to the water pump.

BTW, I may not have understood what you said, but there should be overflow into your expansion tank. Make sure you are keeping a substantial amount of coolant in the expansion tank to keep the cooling system full.

The rads with the plastic caps are only good for 120-150Kmi. The cracked top is a very typical failure. I guess the plastic just gets brittle with age and heat. The fact that your rad and heater core have both experienced failure could be indicative of a head gasket issue, or it may be just coincidence. If you want to have a little more peace of mind, get your mechanic to do a block test to check for any exhaust gases in your coolant. If you do find that the head is indeed leaking, it is prudent to change out the water pump as well as the head repair as Brian has already mentioned because your coolant is likely to have been affected by the gases and may have been corrosive for an extended period.

dave mc

I agree with davemac2, have the block test done, if for nothing more than your peace of mind.

Congratulations on 343,000 miles.

Mike

The cold lower hose may mean you need a water pump. They can corrode to the point that they are not circulating as well as they should, causing high-speed overheating and other strange symptoms.

Considering that the high-speed/hill-climbing overheating was cured by the new thermostat, I doubt it's the water pump.

Despite having adequate cooling now, your water pump may be marginal. Having a cold lower hose means you have marginal circulation. FWIW

Do you drive on dirt roads a lot? (Though this probably isn't the problem), your radiator may need blowing out with an air hose. A street sweeper I used to drive was like that (the temp. would stay within the normal range while running at about 5 mph, but when I'd get up to about 25 or 30, it would start running hot. If I got it up to about 45 mph, it'd plum near be in the red.) :(

Despite having adequate cooling now, your water pump may be marginal. Having a cold lower hose means you have marginal circulation. FWIW

The hose isn't cold all the time.
It gets fairly hot when the thermostat opens and then cools down when it closes.

Do you drive on dirt roads a lot?

No, never.
Most of the miles are highway miles.

I should mention here that the radiator he took out was only about 2 years old, if that. BTW, the above mentioned vehicle is a 1997 Camry CE with 343,000 original miles.

that isn't unusual for a aftermarket plastic tank radiator to fail early. here is a link to the radiator barn. option #2 is a all metal radiator with metal tanks. not only do they last longer but they are rebuildable at a radiator shop! mike

Link:
http://www.radiatorbarn.com/s7.asp?ac=Y&year=1997&make=TOYOTA&model=CAMRY&submodel=ALL+MODELS&engine_size=2.2L

Nice...an all-metal rad. Wonder what the weight penalty is for that copper/brass version versus plastic/aluminum? My other thought..is the OEM coolant type still good for the all-metal version? It was meant to protect the aluminum....

that isn't unusual for a aftermarket plastic tank radiator to fail early. here is a link to the radiator barn. option #2 is a all metal radiator with metal tanks. not only do they last longer but they are rebuildable at a radiator shop! mike

Link:
http://www.radiatorbarn.com/s7.asp?ac=Y&year=1997&make=TOYOTA&model=CAMRY&submodel=ALL+MODELS&engine_size=2.2L


Damn.
I wish I would have had that link before I purchased the rad from my mechanic.
He charged me $200 for the rad alone. That's without the labor.

I guess I didn't have much of a choice at the time though. I was pretty much stranded.

Thanks for the help!

In the future, do not place duplicate threads in different forums. There is no good way to combine them for reference by others since there are so many replies.

My other thought..is the OEM coolant type still good for the all-metal version? It was meant to protect the aluminum....
it should be all right and here is my thinking: the thermostat has some copper and brass in it and it is fine. also the coolant temp sensor is brass and the coolant doesn't hurt the sensors either. lastly i think the radiator barn has a 1-800# to call and ask. They also make metal rads for most other late model makes also (and at half the price of big box auto parts stores)!

In the future, do not place duplicate threads in different forums. There is no good way to combine them for reference by others since there are so many replies.

Yeah, sorry about that.
I didn't realize there was an Engineering/Technical forward until after I posted here already.

No big deal. The Toyota forum is a much better bet than the other for these vehicles. There are always ecentricities which are unique to each vehicle and most of them have been discussed here at one time or another.

I put an all-metal radiator in my 94 Camry and it's terrific.
You can get them online. I googled all metal radiators and found a vendor in Anaheim
The plastic-metal one it replaced had lasted three years/ 40k mil.
Later on, I had a distinct 'skip', and clouds of steam on cold mornings.
"Head gasket or cracked head" was the diagnosis, largely due to running w/o adequate coolant; which explains the new radiator.
Nothing to lose; I owe the car money, I bought some highly-recommended
Barr's copper-seal, which worked beautifully.
The trick is to get every last ounce of AF outa the cooling system B$ you put it in.