Ok. so here's the situation...I've read alot of these threads. and I'm rather new to the 300Z. But I did read Broke As ****** post about dont try to drop $4000.00 if you work at McDonalds thing. So my money budget is being realistic. I have a 1991 300ZX N/A. I"m looking for more power obviously. But at the moment I don't have the money to save up and buy a full TT swap. So the idea I had on my mind was this.... Take the N/A motor as it is now... as per the bore and stroke for the VG30DE is the same as the VG30DETT and it seems that the pistons are interchangeable... my idea is...to take the pistons (which i can get for $240.00 new OEM with rings) for a VG30DETT and put it into my VG30DE, thus dropping compression to make around, i'm guessing 8.5:1 or so....hence more favorable for turbo. Now with that being that I believe, and if I"m wrong, someone please correct me, the blocks, pistons, rods, ect...of the VG30DE are just as strong as the VG30DETT, none the less. I'm sure that the VG30DE with DETT pistons and a 8.5:1 CR, the VG30DE should still be able to handle 8-11psi boost. With that being said, a number of you have stated that it would be a hassle and half to put a single turbo on a VG30DE motor. But now, what I'm' thinking is buying the turbos off a DETT, which i can get with 24k miles on it for around $450.00, add in the piping and what not, upgrade the clutch, grab the ECU, wiring harness, injectors, and that should be the whole DETT swap, without it being a whole DETT swap. Just throwing that out there, because like most people, I don't have the location on my money tree, and spending small amounts of money numerous times, is easier than spending the $2400.00 + labor on the DETT swap. If i missed anything, please let me know, thank you.

Weeeell, the problem you're likely going to run into is that there is a decent bit more to it than piping, wires and injectors. Realistically by the time you've swapped all the required support systems you've pretty much gone through a whole front clip. Also, as I'm sure you're aware, swapping pistons is not quite as simple as swapping fuses. There is an undetermined amount of wear on the crank journals, cylinder walls and other mechanical bits in your motor. This all has to be taken into account when putting it back together.

Here's some good links to get your started.

http://twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=technical&msg_id=737844
http://twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=technical&msg_id=740530
http://twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=technical&msg_id=795363
http://twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=technical&msg_id=699268

But you are correct. If you were to rebuild your motor instead of buying a clip and spend the next year or so pounding the classifieds and looking for the parts you'll need then you could probably pull it off for a few grand. Assuming everything goes right and there isn't a lot of parts that need replacing.

If you want to go this route, dig through every TT swap thread you find, email everyone who's ever done one (Ash of AshSpecZ.com did this very thing and built his NA motor into a TT) and get together a total complete master list of parts you'll need like there has never been before. Then hit the classifieds and the parts suppliers and determine how much every nut, sensor and hose on your list is going to cost you. This ain't going to be easy and it's the reason most just buy the clip.

biggest flaw in your idea is that there are still a few differences between TT and N/A motors internally. this can all be fixed as ashley powers did but it is going to cost more or you will not have the same thing a TT owner would. fors example, oil squirters for the pistons are located and pointed in different places. N/A heads are not the same as TT heads. the part numbers are different and it was found a while back the N/A simply do not flow as well as TT without port work.

also, you forget to account some hard to find parts like stock Intercooler piping. if you have a friend or access to a pipe bender you can probably make your own with some serious designing and time. otherwise look to spend well over $500 for these few pieces as supply is limited and i think they are discontinued or even more expensive through Nissan. little things like TT fuel pump controller and TT fuel pump are the things that you forget about that eat into your wallet.

and lastly, dont ever plan anything to go how you plan unless your plan us flawless and all plans have flaws.

anyways, if i were you, i would simply start collecting parts as in like new clutch, TT fuel pump, 60k mile maitenance kit, etc right now. these parts you know you are going to need new and then once you get the finances to actually do the swap or sell your N/A and by a TT, then you will have these parts at your disposal.

Actually if you take a look at the last link, apparently the oil squirters are the same. The difference, if I recall, was that the TT pistons have a hollow dome that the squirter fit into so oil would be circulated through the piston to cool it down.

excellent. damn you guys are fast. Here's what I was thinking. and both of you are totally right, start collecting the parts for it now. I was thinking, why if i have a good tight motor in it now... why not use it and swap the pistons to drop the compression, and get it ready for the twin turbo. then i could piece together the swap. By using the same Block, then i could use the same clutch, the same flywheel, and hence the same tranny, the same drive shaft, and same diff. with shorter gearing. Saving some money i'm guessing. Then i could just get a longblock TT, instead of needing the whole swap. Next question, do TT heads bolt right onto NA blocks? And as far as the wear problem broke, would that be cure by putting in new rod and main bearings? might as well put them in while i've got it out, and hone the block with new rings. If i'm still way off let me know. I would like to learn as much as i can. I've turboed honda motors and done lots of building and swaps on those, B16's B18's, but they're not a VG30 i know. thanks again.

Actually if you take a look at the last link, apparently the oil squirters are the same. The difference, if I recall, was that the TT pistons have a hollow dome that the squirter fit into so oil would be circulated through the piston to cool it down.

thanks for the correction. i dont know why i thought they were angled different.

By using the same Block, then i could use the same clutch, the same flywheel, and hence the same tranny, the same drive shaft, and same diff. with shorter gearing. Saving some money i'm guessing.

your N/A flywheel and clutch will never hold TT power. you will need an upgraded N/A clutch and flywheel capable of holding the torque you are making which i will assume will be in the 400-500 ft-lbs aream on stock turbos. most guys just buy TT clutch and flywheel instead of messing with the N/A stuff and then removing some metal from the bellhousing allowing the larger flywheel to fit. and then you will need to shim out the starter.


Then i could just get a longblock TT, instead of needing the whole swap. Next question, do TT heads bolt right onto NA blocks? And as far as the wear problem broke, would that be cure by putting in new rod and main bearings? might as well put them in while i've got it out, and hone the block with new rings. If i'm still way off let me know. I would like to learn as much as i can. I've turboed honda motors and done lots of building and swaps on those, B16's B18's, but they're not a VG30 i know. thanks again.

TT heads do bolt right onto N/A blocks as the blocks are identical as far as i know. your plan will work and makes alot of sense beings you will skip over the whole idea of having a used TT motor that you dont know much about. I would start with a rebuilt motor no matter what if i were to do a swap. then nearly everything is brand new and can be trusted. also think about throwing in forged pistons as this is the only weak point of the VG and even though the stockers are not weak they are cast and do not hold up to detonation at all.

As far as the parts swap over sounds..... its about as simple as that except a few minor things. You will need a ECU out of a TT to get it to run right. I personally am a bigger fan of waiting till you have the money to do the complete swap. Honestly the Z32 is a bit more complicated than the Hondas your used to.

I'm the type of person who doesnt like to fab things. Alot of guys that I've worked with can fab things to be better than OEM in some way, Me on the other hand, if it doesn't just bolt right it, or bolt right on, I'll find another way to get it to bolt right it. So that being said, as far as using the tranny of a NA and making a "shimmy"....no thanks. so that means using the whole entire swap, which i found for $2,099.00, but that doesn't include, drive shafts. Now, and i can't say this enough, PLEASE correct me if i'm wrong. to do the TT swap, I still need, AC lines and condensor, a TT radiator, intercooler with piping. and like Broke or K3 said. finding stock intercooling piping isn't like buying bananas. and replacing the entire exhaust most likely. as per i'm guessing the NA would be inadequate for a TT motor. So its not like throw the $2099.00 into a swap and wam bam thank you ma'am i'm done. I figured the whole swap to run around $3800.00 in PARTS alone, then i have someone who will do the swap for $500.00..... now these number work PROVIDING, the engine when i get it, is in TIP TOP shape. Which i dunno, i've bought alot of honda motors, and the people who sell the swaps, say came out of a running car. Well, SH-T, i guess the past 4 swaps i've bought, we're running in a Freakin' lake....with mud...and weeds. I'm just saying, the swap isn't guarenteed that its going to bolt right in, without at least yanking the heads of to take a look inside, then maybe replace bearings, rings ect... so lets just figure, $3800.00 parts, $500 (misc. as in any job), $500 labor. we're talking just about $5000.00, NOW, YES as per Broke and K3 i believe have stated in other threads, it is FAR MORE ECONOMICAL, to sell the NA and just buy a TT, but hell, where's the fun in that. All i'm simply saying is, just short of $5000.00 , there has to be a more creative and cheaper way. At this point, I have more time than money. thanks.

By "wear" I mean depending on the age and condition of the NA motor, it may or may not be as simple as sourcing the same OEM grade of rod/main bearing and honing the cylinder walls. The cylinders, crank journals, rods and main caps are constantly being worn down by the internal whirly bits spinning. Now this is a small amount of wear, as it is measured in thousands of an inch, but when you're dealing with parts that have tolerances measure in thousands of an inch it becomes more important.

If you're going to rebuild the NA block with the TT pistons then I would at least drop the cash to have the crank checked for balance and journal wear, same for the block and rods. That way you can get proper sized main and rod bearings.

Email some VG engine builders and get their take on what you plan on doing. Give them some background on what you've done before and what kind of machinery and tools you have access to.

ok. so i think i've got this figured out. If you guys could just check this though. http://www.jdmenginescorp.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_5&products_id=129

That place has this motor swap...the VG30DETT, but it says its for a 1991-1995, and mine is a 1990. Is there any reason that it wouldn't fit into a 1990, or maybe its just a typo. Not sure. because the engines above it, are for 1990 but only make 280hp as opposed to this VG30DETT that makes the 300hp/283lb/ft. Also providing i can use the swap on that link, what else am I missing? just drive shafts correct? thanks

ok. so i think i've got this figured out. If you guys could just check this though. http://www.jdmenginescorp.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_5&products_id=129

That place has this motor swap...the VG30DETT, but it says its for a 1991-1995, and mine is a 1990. Is there any reason that it wouldn't fit into a 1990, or maybe its just a typo. Not sure. because the engines above it, are for 1990 but only make 280hp as opposed to this VG30DETT that makes the 300hp/283lb/ft. Also providing i can use the swap on that link, what else am I missing? just drive shafts correct? thanks

you want a 91-95 motor as the 90's has issues that were resolved in 91 (search keyword: soft valves). the engines in japan are rated at 280ps because of an agreement between Japanese automakers that they would not make cars producing over a certain amount of PS. the motors make the same power as long as it is out of a 5-speed car. automatics had a variation in turbo size to cope better with the gearing and fact that it is an automatic tranny. if you are buying a clip that is a TT/5-speed, then no worries.

now the item you are looking at is referred to as a swap, not a clip. a front clip will include TT AC condenser, AC lines, radiator, intercooler piping, Intercooler mounting brackets, intercoolers and ducts, COMPLETE wiring harness, transmission, stock recirculation valves, etc. a swap simply does not include any of this and these components of the swap happen to be the hardest to find. trust me, do yourself a favor...contact Z1 motorsports and ask them about a front CLIP. a front clip is a car that has been wrecked or something and they completely cut the car in half right behind the transmission usually. it will include the frame, dashboard, instrument panels, etc. anyways, Z1 will have one from Japan shipped in to them and they will inspect it before selling it to you. it will be well worth the cost...trust me. I did the swap like you are looking at doing, it took me forever to piece everything together, and just when i thought i was done, i had to order more or ran into even more problems.

also, your N/A 5-speed driveshaft will work with the TT 5-speed.

thanks K3. I found a front clip for $2400.00 ...is that a good price or average? it wasn't from Z1 though. i'll check there too. I'll keep posting if i got more questions. but in the mean time. thanks. all you guys that replied, GREAT advice, and thanks for the help.

Depends on who you're getting the clip from. A good price from a known good source like CoZ is going to be higher than a good price from a relatively unknown source.

Go to twinturbo.net and enter the company name in the search box. There is likely someone there that has done business with them.