3000GT vs 300ZX

3000GT vs 300ZX what do think is the best keep in mind best for street racing

it depends. you didn't say which one. the 3000GT SL's are garbage. front wheel drive with 220hp on a body thats atleast 3300lbs. the n/a Z is rear wheel drive and has 220hp as well. but since its a RWD and weight less. the Z takes the cake in the n/a. now for the twin turbos. i would have to say the VR4 would whoop a Z32 TT.

hahaha double posted

wait the 3000GT SL is Front wheel drive ????????????? ahhhhhhhhh:finger:

VR4s are sick

I have to agree VR4's are the shiz, but I still love the 300zx. If you got money to put into it either would make a fast car!

If it is the 300GT SL, then it is garbage and you don't want it. If it is the 300ZX 2+2 then it is garbage and you don't want it. The TT 300ZX IMO would be a better buy, the aftermarket for it is much bigger then the 3000GT.

300ZX is by far a much better car IMO. They may not run 13.6 in the 1/4 stock, but in the long run, there's alot more that can be done to them, and with my experience they're alot more dependable. For a total of about $8000 i got a car, repaired it from dealership condition, and modded it enough to where i can easily take a VR4...not embarrass one, but i can beat'em bad enough to where it's more than obvious. How much do VR4's cost again?? Beleive it or not, modded TT Z32's give me more of a run for my money than ANY 3000GT i've ever raced.

IMO VR4's don't last long, and are unreliable. It's easy to blow the engines, and the trannies like to fall apart........same as the Dodge Stealth (HA)....personally i think the 3000GT's and the Stealth's are both POS's. But hey, like i said IMO.

Personally if you're looking for a street racing car, I'd recommend a 300ZX (and no, not just because I own one). I've two friends, one has owned a VR4 (temporarily....his wife wrecked it), and a another one that owned an R/T Stealth. They were both constantly bithin' back and forth over who's car was better(they're both crap as far as i'm concerned). They were both constantly having mechanical problems, and on a few occasions, when i'd give in and partake in there little weekend runs, i'd beat both of them. (Granted, they were stock, and my car's not, but i just thought i'd throw that part in) N-E-Wayz, there's my 2 cents worth.

How much does a 300ZX weigh? I have heard about problems with the AWS and AWD when people mod them because they just can't handle the work load, I have a friend with a TT Stealth and he doesn't have any problems, besides his own recklessness.

I am sure Yogs will have something to say. :D

about 3400 lbs. the VR4 does way about 200-300 lbs. more. The thing that sells people is the after market availability. The Z has so much more available, and those things are less expensive. They are both great cars, but guess where I will lean. Well kinda falling over. :rolleyes:

I would take a 300zx, but I think that's mainly because the 300zx looks way better than a 3000gt. Both cars have tremendous potential for huge HP.

There is a reat potetial for power with the 3000GT's, but parts are to expensive and few and far between.

Z32!!!!!!!!! i've said it before and i'll say it again. anyways, the VR4 is overly styled, when the Z32 is just a timeless design.

With stock internals, body, and drivetrain, I'd go with the 3000GT... you can get 600hp out of either, but the 3000GT will be easier to drive, with it's extra traction. If giant tires are an option, then that becomes less of a major advantage.

I see fewer 3000GTs, and they look better IMO, especially since I have yet to see a vulgar "shogun" style body kit on one. I'd take a VR4 just to be a little different.

Now the 3800lb curb weight of the 3000GT is quite a drawback, but the 300ZX TT is no lightweight, at 3400 lbs.

Come on Cbass you know you lika da' Z....Uh,,,,You lika da' Z!

Oh, I lika da Z... Oh, ah dat's ah good, oh I lika da dat. ;)

there's a kit like that for the 3k gt, and trust me, it looks as bad as you think it would...

i vote 300zx, only b/c the 3000 has a tendency to break alot of parts when a lot of power is added...

there's a local stealth r/t here with about 900hp, and that's the truth, and he goes through clutches weekly.

the shop that works on my car has a set of 5-6 3000's that rotate in regularly... there's no real upgrade for the trans, and it breaks with a ton of power, the axles are the same...

and besides that...

the ecu's are fairly unreliable, and it's not uncommon to have to completely replace one...

but a 300zx isn't exactly super user friendly, with the engine bay being as tight as it is...

i would vote for the 300zx, becuase of the fact that it is lighter, although not by much, and has more after market for it. i do admit that the vr4 is very cool, but it is too big. the 300zx has always and will always look very exotic.

Like flywsi said... 3kGT has a lot of problems with it's 4WD drivetrain , especially when modified... Here in Europe the transmission for that thing also costs a lot... I'd go for the Z32 , but myslef i would really rather consider FD RX7 (sucks on reliablity , and small too , but faster than both) or a MKIV twin turbo supra , it is more expensive but it is better in all categories (pass the styling , it's a personal thing)...

Price-wise also you can pick a TTZ or an RX-7 up for about the same price range. The VR-4's and Supra's are rare and expesive.

Originally posted by DemonZX
Price-wise also you can pick a TTZ or an RX-7 up for about the same price range. The VR-4's and Supra's are rare and expesive.

I actually see a lot more TT supras than a TT Z, or Rx7, and the vr-4's are the rarest around these parts..

I see a lot of posts talking about the problems with the VR4. As the owner of two and a member of the 3si family - I can safely say some of that is bullshit.

The weakest part of the car is the second syncro from the getrag (spelled that way on purpose) transmission. Sure every car can have problems, but that has to do with care (as with most cars) then design flaws (other then the second syncro) My 94 has 110K miles and the tranny shifts as smooth as the day I bought it.

Once people start talking about mods - its a crap shoot since their is always something more that can be done. Out of the box, the VR4 is the way to go :)













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as stated... i've talked to the owners of these cars.

and the shop that builds them. there's been multiple undiagnosable ecu problems that lead to replacing the ecu. completely. that's what's been recommended by the dealership as well, not just the shop owner.

the other car that fries clutches... big surprise. there's no way to really upgrade the drivetrain. if he got stronger clutch he'd break more parts.

the engine bay is equally tight on both cars... which sucks, but there seems, from what i've seen, to be more aftermarket support for the z.

I was waiting for Yogs response because he does own 2. Thanks man. The quality of the cars also has to do with the way they are driven, and treated. I'm sure yogs takes care of his babies. Other people may get them and just try to rip up the pavement!:rolleyes:

true... however... these are some pretty intense owners up here with the cash to burn, especially b/c it's not cheap to replace an ecu...

and the cars are treated really well...

the car that had the ecu problem was mostly stock, which is interesting...

the other cars are modded, and haven't had that problem, but it's not uncommon, as noted by the owners...

they're all part of the midwest dsm owners club or something... fanatics with tons of cash...

That is pretty damn odd. Well maybe that is just the weak link in the VR4. Will aftermarket ecu's help it in it's quality issue?

i don't know that there was one... at least at that point... about 8 months ago, there wasn't... or i'm sure they would have gone that route...

it's just interesting...

there's alot of electronically controlled devices in the 3kgt, and they've been known to malfunction...

this guy's ecu was replaced b/c there was a relay that was doing something to the point where he couldn't get the car to run. they took it to the dealership, they got it to run, and then went to get gas. and couldn't get it started. and then it lead to the ecu... weird..

my point was that they have so much electronic stuff that can get funked up, as well as the lack of a strong aftermarket for the drivetrain parts that will inevitably be broken...

That is some wierd crizap!:bloated:

I definatly would have to say the 300zx... I love both cars like you can't imagine. But the 300zx is my all time favorite. I remember that when i was car searching about 3 months ago. All i would seach for were 300zx's, but they are rare, and expensive. I almost baught about three different ones and was willing to go way out of state to get it, and all were sold before i could make the catch. After a while i realized that paying so much for a car with more milage than i would feel comfortable with was scary. It is still my all time favorite car though. I love my Grand Prix though so in the long run im happy either way.

Oh, the Z32 wins this one hands down in my book. Simply put, it's the more versatile of the pair. A Z32 can be built as a stout drag car, lovely drifter, Wangan terror, cone-dodging autocrosser, or a corner carving club racer. There's plenty of potential in the VQ35DETT and the 5spd it's connected to is fairly close to bullet-proof (save for the clutch).

Besides, the Z32 in GTS form was the first "production" class car to win the 24hrs of Daytona outright. I think that speaks for itself.

The VQ35DETT hasn't been released, and it looks like the new GTR engine is going to be the VQ33DETT ;)

You're thinking of the VG30DETT

Whoops! :D

Guess I'm just dreaming of an Infiniti G35 Sport Coupe and a pair of intercooled Garretts.

But still, I've always loved Nissan sixes, straight or vee. I wonder what would happen if they made a twelve?

i often wonder, since im not much of a turbo/supercharged guy, what are some specifications on the cheapest trim level supra. (02-03)

220hp on the NA Supra. Stopped producing them in '98 though if I'm not mistaken. Definitely no 2002 or 2003s

Originally posted by Self
220hp on the NA Supra. Stopped producing them in '98 though if I'm not mistaken. Definitely no 2002 or 2003s

Are you serious? How could i let something like that go without knowing. Jeez, and i loved that car. What is with all the great cars leaving the production lines anymore? It's starting to tick me off.:(

Well, the Supra wasn't selling. It was the same reason the FD and the 300ZX left the market in the mid-90's. They priced themselves out of the market they created; mid-priced high performance two seat coupes.

It's too bad. At least the Z's back and there's a new rotary (with a coupe in the wings, they say). Who knows? There might be a new Supra coming along.

Originally posted by Octagon
Well, the Supra wasn't selling. It was the same reason the FD and the 300ZX left the market in the mid-90's. They priced themselves out of the market they created; mid-priced high performance two seat coupes.

It's too bad. At least the Z's back and there's a new rotary (with a coupe in the wings, they say). Who knows? There might be a new Supra coming along.

That's it exactly. They tried to get too much money out of the niche they were in. Same reason all good things end...They got greedy:D

Shouldn't this post be in the car comparisons room if it hasn't been?

I'd go with the Z. All the reasons why I would have been said.

Actually, there is a new Supra on the way. It's supposed to use the Lexus DOHC V8, and there is no mention of a turbo version :(

3000GT V6 TT 6 speed right? also has crap handling
300ZX V6 TT 5 Speed not as fast in a line but has better handling

what sort of street racing?

If any of you guys know a good link to concept supras, can you post it, i know one site that is decient but has very little stat wise... but then again i guess you could expect that since it hasn't been even close to production yet. but still, id like to see another link.

Mazda is thinking of bringing back the RX-7! If the RX-8 sales are good they are going to bring it back! The new rotary will put out 280hp natuarly aspirated! CLick! definately not

Don't get me wrong, i am crazy about the RX-7. But i just don't see what is so special about the rotery engines. They are so much maintinence (at least previous models) and have horrible emissions output, bad gas milage. All that, when you could get more power from cylinders. Id put my money on any 300zx TT over a RX-7 turbo. I think it's an awsome idea that Mazda is doing something unique, but what's the point if it doesn't have many positives over regular engines? I hope they bring back the RX-7, but as long as they are going to be roteries, i prob wouldn't get one.

Well, the rotary is special because it produce far more power from far less displacement with fewer parts to break.

A rotary has no valvetrain, no cams, no connecting rods or timing connections. The only part on a rotary that really breaks from use is the apex seal. They're actually a more mechanically efficient engine.

Then there's the size. If you measure it out, a Mazda 13B only displaces 1.3L. Now, think about that. a 1.3L engine that puts out 202 naturally aspirated horsepower. Is it any wonder that these engines are finding their way into more and more small sports cars? Mazda 13B's are finding their way into Spitfires, 510's, Midgets, Sprites, Caterhams, and most recently I saw a turbo 13B in a Triumph TR7.

True, they're odd little beasts and when those apex seals go it's a BIG problem. But the rotary is a marvel of German engineering, tempered with Japanese know-how and dedication. Mazda has made their reputation on the back of this little gem. Idiosyncracies or not, it's a great little engine.

oh, i sort of see why now. But isn't it true that they are hard to pass emissions standards with? I heard though that the turboed wankels didn't put out that much power, wasn't it in the 200 range even though the engine gets that range naturally aspirated. I would think it would be at least to the 300 range.

That's another simple one. RX-7's with turbos made 276hp. Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbos made 276hp. Nissan Skyline GT-R's made 276hp. Mitsubishi Lancer Evolutions made 276hp. Toyota Supra TT's made 276hp. Subaru Impreza STi's made 276hp.

Notice a pattern?

Back in the 60's (I think) the Japanese auto manufacturers, wanting to avoid the American Horsepower wars, all signed an agreement called the Gentlemen's Agreement that limited all cars to 276hp. Thus, they would concentrate on safety, economy, quality, and reliability as opposed to getting caught up in some silly contest of numbers.

The agreement wasn't formally broken until Nissan introduced the current generation of Infiniti Q45's (forget the JDM name) whose V8's make in excess of 340hp.

In reality, a turbo RX-7 is making that 276 with a fairly light amount of boost and restrictive intake and exhaust. With light LIGHT mods (chip, cat-back exhaust, intake) you can net an easy reliable 340hp. In fact, 400hp turbo 13B's are a fairly common and easy piece. You just have to be careful with the boost. Too much boost and insufficient cooling (the real problem with a rotary) means that you can blow apex seals in a heartbeat. Those are only tiny pieces of carbon acting as gaskets. Just as astronomical compression will blow a piston engine's head gasket, too much boost at high temperatures will blow head gaskets in a rotary.

That better?

Originally posted by Octagon
That's another simple one. RX-7's with turbos made 276hp. Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbos made 276hp. Nissan Skyline GT-R's made 276hp. Mitsubishi Lancer Evolutions made 276hp. Toyota Supra TT's made 276hp. Subaru Impreza STi's made 276hp.

Notice a pattern?

Back in the 60's (I think) the Japanese auto manufacturers, wanting to avoid the American Horsepower wars, all signed an agreement called the Gentlemen's Agreement that limited all cars to 276hp. Thus, they would concentrate on safety, economy, quality, and reliability as opposed to getting caught up in some silly contest of numbers.

The agreement wasn't formally broken until Nissan introduced the current generation of Infiniti Q45's (forget the JDM name) whose V8's make in excess of 340hp.

In reality, a turbo RX-7 is making that 276 with a fairly light amount of boost and restrictive intake and exhaust. With light LIGHT mods (chip, cat-back exhaust, intake) you can net an easy reliable 340hp. In fact, 400hp turbo 13B's are a fairly common and easy piece. You just have to be careful with the boost. Too much boost and insufficient cooling (the real problem with a rotary) means that you can blow apex seals in a heartbeat. Those are only tiny pieces of carbon acting as gaskets. Just as astronomical compression will blow a piston engine's head gasket, too much boost at high temperatures will blow head gaskets in a rotary.

That better?

That's actually really interesting, i did notice alot of the imports were always wandering in the same range, and the same went for the nonturbos too... Supra (222) 300zx (222) 3000GT (222). The only thing i thought was... didn't the 3000GT (TT) Make around 325 and 300ZX (TT) 300. i believe that was always their rating (as of 1990, which was the first year the ZX was made) but maybe not. Does anyone have a twin turb. of either?

Actually, in that case you're only taling about the JDM versions. The gentleman's agreement was set at 280 hp. Nissan was also the first to break it..this is true. However:
US Spec Supras are rated at 320 bhp
US Spec 300ZXTT are rated 300 bhp
US Spec Rx-7's are rated at 320 bhp
US Spec 3000GT VR-4's.. 320 bhp
In reality the Japanese versions do have some differences. The aftermarket...market (too many markets) supports all of these cars but if you are looking best overall performance for the cheapest modified price you are not looking at either the 300 zx or the 3000GT. for price I would go with either the TT Supra which can put out huge hp numbers for about 3 grand, or the RX-7's which have the same abilities. However, initial investment into an Rx-7 or TT Supra is going to be much higher than a 3000ZX. VR-4's are still expensive. So basically, it will all boil down to personal opinion. And we can argue about that ad ifinitum.

I had a Twin Turbo Supra...until I ripped out the twins and put a much larger single in it

Originally posted by Supra650RSP
I had a Twin Turbo Supra...until I ripped out the twins and put a much larger single in it

Was it faster now or before?

The RX-7 had 255 hp. It is sop fast because it is so light. Everything else is correct!

Originally posted by DemonZX
The RX-7 had 255 hp. It is sop fast because it is so light. Everything else is correct!

yea, i think 255 sounds more correct

Originally posted by pontiactrac


Was it faster now or before?

Swapping a larger single turbo for the small twin turbo's on a Supra is a fairly common mod. Yields much more horsepower than the smaller twins can produce.

Plus a better low end response! i.e. less time to spool....well depending on the size of the turbo of course.

jeez, and i thought nothing beat the twins. not even a supercharger

Well, on a straight engine a single works as well as a twin setup. In fact, many twin-turbo setups on inline engines used a smaller turbo to more quickly spool a larger one.

However, the drawback to a large single is lag. Just ask Porsche 935 and Zakspeed Capri/Mustang drivers from the old Silohouette era. Those monster turbos turn your throttle into a lightswitch.

It goes something like this.

nothingnothingnothingnothingnothingnothingnothing POWER ON SNAP OVERSTEER

Hence, twins usually work better for cornering and acceleration. Also, two turbos (one per bank) is more efficient for a Vee or Flat engine.

yea, i heard turbo lag is a real bitch. Id still like to have either, but i guess my engine is just running the old fashion way lol.

i don't have a lot of experience driving turbo cars. I have drivin a bunch, but maybe 1 or 2 times a piece. From what i have encoutered it all depends on the car+setup. If it is a high reving turbo car i.e. Supra/Skyline it is better for a single setup. We'll exclude 4 cylinders, because well they can only have one turbo! Anyway...Now like a V engine we'll say a 300zx/Audi will benfit off of the twin setup. Single turbo V engine cars are not the most efficient or reliable. Now, it also depends on the type of racing you will be doing. If it is auto-X or track a sequential turbo setup may be better. You have the quick respose of a single, and the flat out power of a twin on the straights. So It really all depends on what you are using it for, and what you like!:cool:

why am i always too late when things gets interesting? anyways, pontiactrac your missing the whole point of hte RX-7. the RX-7 has a rotary engine because its small compact and can be placed closer to the center line of the chassis. this give the car a perfect 50/50 weight distribution. that is why alot of people love the RX-7. it has very neutral handling. the RX-7's also only weights 2800lb because of the motor. when every other competitor weights from 3500lb (300ZX TT) to 3800lb (3000GT VR4) the Supra's weigh will fall somewhere in between the Z and the VR4. the supras are also big cars, they are heavy as cows. now for the hp rating. yes nissan was the first to break it. nissan was to first to hit 280hp with the Z32 (300ZX TT) back in 1989. they were also the first to truely challenge european super cars at the time. the Z wwas almost as fast as a low level ferrari. then one year later, they reintroduced the R32 skyline GT-R after like 13 years of absence which by the way makes over 300hp at the wheels. and they only continue to make more power as each gen goes. so all hail nissan!! supras are nice cars, but they dont' really have anything significant about them that would put them in the hall of fame besides being the only other japanese super car that make over 1000hp. however, the most power i ever saw being made in a japanese import was the R33 skyline GT-R from www.extervimini.com he has a purple one that puts out 887Kw at all 4 wheels!!! 887Kw is around 1100hp at the wheels. and this is on a 4 wheel driver tranny. i you times that by 1.25% to compensate for the lose goin down tot he wheels. you get over 1600hp at the crank!!!!

There it is! CLick! NISSAN!

Turbo lag is very dependent on how you have built your engine. An engine with higher static compression and lower boost will make excellent low end torque, with very little turbo lag. A single ball bearing turbocharger on an inline engine will see no noticable lag with 9:1 compression. With advanced engine electronics, you can then run as much boost as possible, and prevent detonation.

If you have a Vee engine, having two turbochargers can be preferrable, as it improves exhaust flow, and cuts turbo lag considerably. Two larger turbochargers will make just as much boost and flow just as well as one huge turbocharger, it's just more expensive and complicated to do it that way.

The vicious turbo lag of cars like the 935 were a result of very low static compression, 7:1 or even 6.5:1 in some cases, a big turbocharger, and mechanical fuel injection, compared to the modern EFI we have, with integral distributorless ignition.