Ignition Key problem


dgmaley
12-03-2005, 12:59 PM
Checking to see if anyone has experienced an intermittant problem
removing the Cobalt ignition key? I suspect it is caused by the
automatic transmission lockout not releasing properly. It's been
intermittant enough that it's been impossible to track down. Any
help would really be appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Dave Maley
Cedar Rapids,iowa.

BullDog71ss
12-04-2005, 09:08 PM
Haven't got a clue dude, sorry I can't help on this one. Talk to GM about it.

QuasiMofo
12-04-2005, 09:48 PM
Manual trans here, so I have no assistance either.

I do however love the fact that the ignition switch is basically a starter button inside the lock cylinder. I can barely tap the ignition and it goes through the startup function. I get into my wifes Dodge and I can never start the damned thing... always forget to hold the key!

don2
12-23-2005, 09:24 PM
Checking to see if anyone has experienced an intermittant problem
removing the Cobalt ignition key? I suspect it is caused by the
automatic transmission lockout not releasing properly. It's been
intermittant enough that it's been impossible to track down. Any
help would really be appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Dave Maley
Cedar Rapids,iowa.


Yes, I have been experincing this same problem on my 2005 Cobalt LT sedan with about 12,000 miles. It has been to the dealership 4 times for this in the last 3 weeks or so. It was intermittent on my car too and they only had it happen once at the dealership randomly, they have said they can not get the car to repeat the problem.There was a part replaced on trip two, problem occured almost immediately after leaving dealership and there were adjustments made to the shift lock on trip three, they thought they had the problem figured out, but the fix lasted about a week at most. The problem intensified greatly between trip 3 and 4. The car is now wih the dealer since Tuesday, they believe it is related to the shift lock solenoid, but told me today they are having a problem getting the part which I guess comes as part of an assembly. The dealer has been very helpful so far and have given me a loaner Impala to drive while they have my car, Sounds like it is possible the part may take some time to get, hopefuly this wil be the end of the problem.

dgmaley
12-24-2005, 12:11 PM
Well I have good news. The dealer was willing to work with me and we
were able to solve the problem. This also required a couple of calls
on the dealer tech line. Here's how to see if you have the same probem:
There is a safety ignition circuit involving the brake light switch, transmission park switch, and the shift lever button switch. All three must be in the correct position for the car to start, or the key to be removed. It appears that in my car, the shift lever button switch was very close to the edge of the tolerance. The switch made contact just at the point where the button popped all the way out. Any small amount of dirt in the button would hang the switch up and the key could not be removed. The dealer replaced the button and switch in the shift lever. The original had a chrome plated cover, the replacement was just a black plastic, but has a much smoother action. It is possible to hear the action of the safety system by moving these switches without the engine running. If you can take your hand away from the shift lever with the switch hanging, you've got it. Don't forget to spray a little WD-40 on your ignition key and run it through the mechinism.
Hope you find your intermittant.
Dave....



Yes, I have been experincing this same problem on my 2005 Cobalt LT sedan with about 12,000 miles. It has been to the dealership 4 times for this in the last 3 weeks or so. It was intermittent on my car too and they only had it happen once at the dealership randomly, they have said they can not get the car to repeat the problem.There was a part replaced on trip two, problem occured almost immediately after leaving dealership and there were adjustments made to the shift lock on trip three, they thought they had the problem figured out, but the fix lasted about a week at most. The problem intensified greatly between trip 3 and 4. The car is now wih the dealer since Tuesday, they believe it is related to the shift lock solenoid, but told me today they are having a problem getting the part which I guess comes as part of an assembly. The dealer has been very helpful so far and have given me a loaner Impala to drive while they have my car, Sounds like it is possible the part may take some time to get, hopefuly this wil be the end of the problem.

cobalt1184
01-13-2006, 06:01 PM
i bought my cobalt in may of 2005.i recently hit the 12000mile mark, and since then , my car has been in the shop for the third time in 3 weeks for my key locking in the ignition. i find that when i jam it into park and shift it around, ill eventually get it out....i was satisfied with my car up until recently, and i heard rumors that the cobalt does not rank very well on consumer reports now. so my car is sitting in the shop yet again, as the wheels of monotony go round and round....no longer satisfied and kind of panicked.

don2
01-13-2006, 06:44 PM
The dealer seems to have fixed my car, it was losing the ground, they found it in the A/T shift lock solenoid. From my paperwork, it looks like the part # that was replaced is 15244165. I've had it back for abut two weeks and it seems to be fine. My dealer was good about being persistant enough to get this fixed, wish they would have fixed it the first time but they tried to minimize my inconvience as much as possible. I'm still happy with my car. Good luck getting your car fixed.


i bought my cobalt in may of 2005.i recently hit the 12000mile mark, and since then , my car has been in the shop for the third time in 3 weeks for my key locking in the ignition. i find that when i jam it into park and shift it around, ill eventually get it out....i was satisfied with my car up until recently, and i heard rumors that the cobalt does not rank very well on consumer reports now. so my car is sitting in the shop yet again, as the wheels of monotony go round and round....no longer satisfied and kind of panicked.

Carmen G
05-18-2007, 06:14 AM
I am also having problems with the ignition. When I park the car the key does not want to come out. I have been resolving the problem by either driving around the block or reversing into another spot and then forward to the original spot and then I can remove the key. I called Chevy and filed a complaint and hopefully everyone else is doing the same thing. If a complaint is not filed we will not get our cars fixed.

Hinshawwrx
05-18-2007, 01:45 PM
Guys who are having this problem take it to the dealer and tell them to search Service Information for the TSB. They have to replace the automatic shifter assembly to fix the problem!

Bdal12
06-09-2007, 10:53 PM
My key kept getting stuck in the ignition too. I have a 2006 Cobalt. When I took my car in to the dealership, it never got stuck, but they found I had a piece broken somewhere that was keeping my key from being released. They fixed it now it works again!

venus
06-13-2007, 03:58 PM
I also started having this problem on my automatic trans 2005 Cobalt, not my 2006 SS/SC.

In case you need to get the key out in a hurry, there is a small square cover on the underside of the steering column. Take that off, and there is a small white button inside there that you push, and that will allow you to remove the key. I'm taking my car in on Monday to get this fixed.

sufucobalt
03-09-2008, 02:08 PM
I own a 2005 cobalt and the key keeps getting stuck. I have been told that it is a problem with many of the 2005 cobalts. I was told I have to make sure the shifter is in the right spot. Usually I can mess with the shifter (park - reverse - park again) and it will come out. Today the key was stuck for over an hour, when i finally discovered the little button under the steering wheel. When I use the release buttone it comes out, but it still gets stuck the next time. I KNOW it has something to do with the shifter not sitting in the right spot.

krafchs02
06-15-2010, 09:42 AM
I have a 2006 cobalt, I am having ignition problems aswell...I had my shifter replaced back in 2007 and now in 2010 my key is getting stuck in the ignition and won't come out. I played with the shifter back and forth and the key came out...did anyone find out the problem so it would be a lot easier taking it to the shop...it is not under warranty anymore...

chevymandan
10-09-2011, 07:58 PM
I have an 04 impala and I had the same problem. Takes about 30 min and $0 to fix. Only tool you need is a flat head screw driver.
1. Take off lower panel by drivers side feet for access
2. You will see a cable coming from the back of the ignition. This cable only allows you to start the car when it is in P or N and only allows you to shift out of park when your foot is on the brake. There is a black piece with a white plastic clip on it. Pull this clip out (not off) with the flat head screw driver. This allows you to move the cable in and out for adjustment. When you think you have it, press the clip back in and give it a try. You want to make sure that you can only shift from P when your foot is on the brake and that you can only start the car in P or N. And of course you want to make sure you can get the key in and out. If it does not work try again. It takes a few tries to get it right.

Christine89
02-23-2012, 07:28 PM
I drive a 2006 Cobalt that I bought used in November of 2008 with 39,000 miles. At around 110,000 miles, the ignition began holding my keys hostage. I called a dealer and they told me it was a problem in the starter. 3 weeks ago, I took it in and it turned out that my entire gear shift needed replaced. I haven't had a problem since. It cost me $385 but so far has been the only repair I've had to pay out of pocket for. I hope this helps!

tomj76
04-09-2012, 11:23 AM
Mine doesn't hold the key. Instead the key won't turn the ignition. I have a standard transmission, so there is no linkage between the shift lever and the key.

Both times this occured I was eventually able to get it to work. I have two aftermarket keys and one dealer key. The first time this happened, I was using one of the aftermarket keys, and no amount of messing around allowed the key to work. I tried the dealer key, but that didn't help either. Eventually I tried my second aftermarket key (which is cut slightly wrong as it does not work on the trunk lock), and this worked. I took it to a dealer for repair, but the key no longer showed the symptom. The dealer claimed the problem was due to the key, not the cylinder and left it as is (even though the dealer key also would not work).

In the second occurance of this I was able to get it work by jostling the key and steering wheel.

GMCustomerService
04-09-2012, 12:43 PM
Mine doesn't hold the key. Instead the key won't turn the ignition. I have a standard transmission, so there is no linkage between the shift lever and the key.

Both times this occured I was eventually able to get it to work. I have two aftermarket keys and one dealer key. The first time this happened, I was using one of the aftermarket keys, and no amount of messing around allowed the key to work. I tried the dealer key, but that didn't help either. Eventually I tried my second aftermarket key (which is cut slightly wrong as it does not work on the trunk lock), and this worked. I took it to a dealer for repair, but the key no longer showed the symptom. The dealer claimed the problem was due to the key, not the cylinder and left it as is (even though the dealer key also would not work).

In the second occurance of this I was able to get it work by jostling the key and steering wheel.

When did you go in to have this looked into, tomj76? If I can follow up on this with your dealership, please let me know in a private message (include your name, the last 8 of your VIN, current mileage, and the name of your dealership).

All the best,
Sarah
GM Customer Service

tim.marshall
09-13-2013, 01:36 PM
Hi,

I have a 2008 Cobalt Sport. My key will not turn at all when I put it into the iginition. I have spoken to a couple mechanics and lock smiths. They all gave me advice on turning the wheel and key at the same time, hitting the steering column while turning the key, putting some WD40 in the ignition and then the key. Nothing has worked. I ordered a new Ignition Cylinder. Does that sound like the best next step to take? Replacing the Ignition Cylinder?

Thank you,
Tim

GMCustomerService
09-13-2013, 03:48 PM
tim.marshall,

You can also provide us with your VIN so we can verify you do not have a special coverage on this concern.

Erica Tiffany (Assisting Sarah)
GM Customer Care

Tech II
09-13-2013, 06:24 PM
Yes, it sounds like a tumbler problem......since you have a worn original key, and two after market keys, I would have a new key cut by the dealer or a locksmith, with your VIN number information.....then have the lock cylinder coded with the correct new tumblers(locksmith or dealer can do this).....When the key is installed in the lock cylinder, you will see the locking tab, flush with the cylinder, if it isn't, then there is an incorrect tumbler installed....

Now since you have a new key that works, it can be copied, or just buy keys from the key machine, that match your VIN(dealer or locksmith)....before installing the cylinder back into the car, test all the new keys, that they make the locking tab flush with the cylinder.....

tomj76
09-16-2013, 11:53 AM
Since I made my orignal post, I've learned the source of the Cobalt key problem I was having.

The problem was due to the lock cylinder. When the key is inserted into the lock cylinder, a metal tab should move to a recessed position to allow the tumbler assembly to turn in the cylinder. In my case it was hanging up intermittently. I cleaned and lubricated it with WD40 and 3-in-1 oil. This helped a lot.

I don't have the car anymore, but I now have a 2009 Cobalt that has not shown this problem. I purchase a new master key (no security chip) and three new after market keys, all of which were made by a locksmith.

Calvin the car man
04-12-2014, 01:25 AM
I don't think they should be driven until fixed even if chevy has posted a DIY how to stop the problem video

Tech II
04-12-2014, 09:47 AM
Calvin you are talking about two different problems.....the recall that is coming out, has nothing to do with turning the key......the recall is to fix a problem, where, when the key is in the ignition in the "run" position, with the car running, it's possible for the key to inadvertently move to the accessory position while driving or if the car goes out of control.....if the key moves to accessory, you lose your air bags, your power steering, and the engine will die....all the recall does is replace the detent in the ignition switch, which will make it harder to move the key to the accessory position, from the "run" position......it has nothing to do with the tumblers in the lock cylinder, since they will not be replaced in this campaign....

If you have a lock cylinder, that does not easily turn when the key is inserted, and you try your backup key, and have the same problem, then the lock cylinder and tumblers need to be replaced......the campaign does not do this....

tomj76
04-26-2014, 04:27 PM
Are these posts from "GMCustomerService" an actual General Motors Corporation employee working as a representative of the company? If so, how can this be verified that they are not a phishing scheme?

GMCustomerService
04-27-2014, 01:03 PM
Hi tomj76,

We can understand why you would be apprehensive to send your personal information. If it would suit you better to speak with someone by phone, our Customer Assistance Center would be happy to assist you. They can be reached at 800-222-1020, Monday - Saturday 8AM - 9PM EST. We hope to hear from you soon.

Thank you,

Andraya R.
GM Customer Care

j cAT
04-30-2014, 11:13 AM
Are these posts from "GMCustomerService" an actual General Motors Corporation employee working as a representative of the company? If so, how can this be verified that they are not a phishing scheme?

I believe that this is a GM rep. these GM employees/contractors are here to take from our forum , but not give anything , to those of us trying to help and share info on the issues of our vehicles.

If GM is concerned about safety then no more private EMAILS with any info or help .

GM customer service here is BASICALLY damage control !

GMCustomerService
04-30-2014, 12:06 PM
I believe that this is a GM rep. these GM employees/contractors are here to take from our forum , but not give anything , to those of us trying to help and share info on the issues of our vehicles.

If GM is concerned about safety then no more private EMAILS with any info or help .

GM customer service here is BASICALLY damage control !

Hi j cAT,

It seems that you may have some doubts about our role here on the forum and our apologies if you feel we've been of little help. Although we don't have anything to hide, we request that you contact us through email or message in order to protect any personal contact information that would otherwise be made accessible by the public. The safety of all customers is very important to us and we're actively working to help address customer concerns.

If you have any specific issues that you would like for us to look into we're available by phone at 800-521-7300, email at socialmedia@gm.com, or private message here on the forum. We would be more than happy to assist to the best of our ability.

Thank you,

Amber N.
GM Customer Care

j cAT
04-30-2014, 06:20 PM
Hi j cAT,

It seems that you may have some doubts about our role here on the forum and our apologies if you feel we've been of little help. Although we don't have anything to hide, we request that you contact us through email or message in order to protect any personal contact information that would otherwise be made accessible by the public. The safety of all customers is very important to us and we're actively working to help address customer concerns.

If you have any specific issues that you would like for us to look into we're available by phone at 800-521-7300, email at socialmedia@gm.com, or private message here on the forum. We would be more than happy to assist to the best of our ability.

Thank you,

Amber N.
GM Customer Care

The GM role here is not to share information about any issues with these vehicles.GM has over the years , has shown to hide any issues with the vehicles . Many including myself had had warranty issues. then the dealership says its GM corp as the problem then GM says its a dealership issue.

The forums with sharing members is a great tool to cut threw the GM fog , to see clearly why these issues are occurring , and also how to repair or to aid the forum member in the handling of the dealership , to correct the failures of the vehicle when defective design or improper factory assy creates vehicle failures.

having owned GM vehicles since 1967 I am well aware of how this corp operates.
these forums have saved me and many others a lot of costs with the info shared here, and on the many other internet forums.

GM no longer can hide behind the legal department . that's where they send you when you put up a fight over a warranty issue that is a safety defect. It is true GM has the power to stall the litigation for 10 yrs , but in the end gm just looses more customers.

amber if you want to help forum members , act like a member , and share info with all of us..
I do not have any issues with GM now. I do not use the dealership to correct any warranty issues when my vehicles are new because sometimes they damage the vehicle or do improper repair work . I find in the end it is much cheaper to do all the fixes myself , steal the TSB about my vehicles so that I have a good handle on the vehicles failures.

GMCustomerService
04-30-2014, 07:24 PM
The GM role here is not to share information about any issues with these vehicles.GM has over the years , has shown to hide any issues with the vehicles . Many including myself had had warranty issues. then the dealership says its GM corp as the problem then GM says its a dealership issue.

The forums with sharing members is a great tool to cut threw the GM fog , to see clearly why these issues are occurring , and also how to repair or to aid the forum member in the handling of the dealership , to correct the failures of the vehicle when defective design or improper factory assy creates vehicle failures.

having owned GM vehicles since 1967 I am well aware of how this corp operates.
these forums have saved me and many others a lot of costs with the info shared here, and on the many other internet forums.

GM no longer can hide behind the legal department . that's where they send you when you put up a fight over a warranty issue that is a safety defect. It is true GM has the power to stall the litigation for 10 yrs , but in the end gm just looses more customers.

amber if you want to help forum members , act like a member , and share info with all of us..
I do not have any issues with GM now. I do not use the dealership to correct any warranty issues when my vehicles are new because sometimes they damage the vehicle or do improper repair work . I find in the end it is much cheaper to do all the fixes myself , steal the TSB about my vehicles so that I have a good handle on the vehicles failures.


Hi j CAT,

We understand and we apologize for any frustrations. We truly appreciate your feedback and will be sure to document it within our system. Please feel free to let us know if you ever have any questions or concerns. Thank you.

Kristen A. (Assisting)
GM Customer Care

rkvons
05-01-2014, 12:21 PM
Hi j CAT,

We understand and we apologize for any frustrations. We truly appreciate your feedback and will be sure to document it within our system. Please feel free to let us know if you ever have any questions or concerns. Thank you.

Kristen A. (Assisting)
GM Customer Care
I am a GM customer. Always have been. I bought a 1998 Montana mini van brand new off the lot. After about 4 years the A/C started leaking oil from the compressor. I know it was not my fault. I called customer service and they said I had to get it diagnosed. I told them the compressor was leaking. They said I had to get it diagnosed. So I paid $150 to get it diagnosed. They told me the compressor was bad. I went back to the person in customer service I was dealing with and they said, yeah, we will not be able to help you here. The dealership wanted $1500 to fix it. I paid $150 for nothing. Try Kristen, if you can, to understand why you would really have to start doing something different from what you are currently doing to be called helpful. And don't give me that "We understand and we apologize for any frustrations..... blah blah blah" stuff.

tomj76
06-12-2014, 09:53 AM
On the point of how warrenty repair works at a GM dealership, I'd have agree with "j cAT".

Take my afforementioned experience with ignition key as an example. When I presented the dealership with the problem, they had two options... they could have presumed that the problem had to be with the cylinder (since even the GM issued key had not worked) or they could use the excuse that my aftermarket keys were causing the problem. Since the problem was intermittent, it was easy to argue for either one. They chose the later, they blamed my keys. In addition, they tried to charge me a fee for examining the vehicle, since they had determined it was not a warrenty repair. It was only after a very loud converstation at the service desk that the manager excused the fee. And because they couldn't reproduce the problem they refused to replace the lock cylinder under the warrenty to prevent me or my family from being stranded by a car that couldn't be started.

Several months later I took the cylinder out of the steering column to try to understand the cause of this (it had occured again). It didn't take long to understand the tab mechanism was hanging up. I'm not a certified mechanic, but I somehow was able to make a correct diagnosis of an intermittent problem where the GM certified tech was not. Go figure.

I had another experience with GM warrenty coverage many years prior that was similar, except in that case they first misdiagnosed the problem (which was with the computer) and replaced the temperature sender (for which I was charged). When I came to pick up the vehicle I did not even get it off the lot. Next they replaced the computer module under warrenty (which corrected the problem). They gave me a hard time when I told them to refund my money for the incorrect diagnosis.

To be fair, I've had the same type of treatment from my Ford dealership. I was not treated this way at my Honda dealership, mostly because that vehicle never needed repair while under warrenty.

Tech II
06-12-2014, 04:15 PM
There are good doctors and bad ones....there are good lawyers and bad ones....there are good dealerships, and bad ones....

Worked for GM dealerships for many years, and I personally know they bend over backwards for their customers...

Now let me say this....If you pop into a dealership, for just recall or warranty repairs....they will do the work, free of charge......but, they are not going to fix something if it can't be recreated, or is not a known problem....

and when your car is out of warranty, don't come into that dealership demanding this and that, especially if you are not a steady customer....

If you are a steady customer, that comes into the dealership for regular maintenance, and that dealership has records on file confirming it, if you have a problem just out of warranty, I guarantee that SM will make every effort to back you up with GM on a repair or at least a break on the cost of the repair....they go out of their way, to help steady GM customers....but if you are someone who pops in to try and get something for nothing, it isn't going to happen....

I know customers, that always bought their cars from the same dealer, were treated one way, while those that didn't were treated differently....

It's the same with all dealerships, whether it's GM, Ford, Toyota, etc.

I have seen customers come into the dealership, and complain that their transmission has a problem, and they want it fixed for free, because a tranny shouldn't fail at 60K......it shouldn't....but the dealership has no record of this person ever bringing their car to this dealership, or any kind of maintenance record, and this customer wants the SM to go to bat for him? It's not going to happen....

If a customer ever has a problem, and the car is under warranty, and the dealership can't recreate the problem, then you should get a copy of the repair order.....if the car should have the same problem, and this happens just outside of your warranty, that previous repair order, can be used to get the repair fixed for free, even though out of warranty....

If you don't have a good relationship with a dealership, like any other repair business, they will look the other way...in your case there are TSB bulletins all over the place concerning tumbler problems causing intermittent problems with turning the ignition key.....it should have been repaired, if the car was still under the 3yr/36K warranty....if they didn't, and you were under warranty, then you should have called GM Customer Assistance......and like I said, if you had the copy of the repair oder stating they couldn't recreate the problem at the time, and then it finally happened, and was just out of warranty, they would have fixed it...

It's a dog eat dog world out there in the car repair business.....dealerships want your business....if you buy a car form any Dealer, be it Chrysler, Hyundai, Nissan, etc., go to them for your repairs and maintenance...it will pay off in the long run......

j cAT
06-13-2014, 09:26 AM
I just do not trust the dealerships with any repairs. the reason is they will break parts to jack up the bill. GM dealerships are what I am talking about since this is my personal experience. also replacing the most expensive parts first then when it fails again they say well that part was bad . so how do you argue that one now its 2 parts failing at the same time or perhaps 6 parts till they finally guess which is the problem.

basically most of these dealership techs are newbies to the auto repair world. they just do what the service manager says and this is done to increase the managers kick back.
any service tech that has a high skill level will not work for a dealership.

I worked at a dealership for a time ,,customers get screwed because like was stated the customers are idiots most times , so it is an easy score.

If you use these forums and do some work to understand these vehicles , you can protect your self some what .

the lock cylinder being the issue with this post is a good example of how they troubleshoot .

Tech II
06-13-2014, 03:49 PM
I worked for GM, and more often than not, they bent over backwards for their customers......thought I was a pretty good tech, with a high skill level.....enjoyed working for a dealership.......the practices you mentioned, would not be allowed in our shop.....I have never seen anyone break parts to jack up a bill....if you've seen this, you should have not only reported it to the SM but also to GM Customer Service.......

As I said before, there are good dealerships, and bad ones.....GM, Toyota, Chrysler, Ford, etc.

Normal maintenance, you can just about go anywhere......driveability problems, I would always go to a dealer and ask for their top Tech....

As I said before, if you think work was done wrong complain.....even in the editorial section of your local newspaper......but, as a GM tech, I take exception when someone comes here on this site, and lumps every GM dealership as trying to screw the customer.....I took pride in my work, and I always spread myself around the shop, if guys ran into problems.....SM's I worked for were honest and fair.....

The object of ANY business, is to make money....but not by screwing the public......that practice will cause you to lose business quickly, by word of mouth....

j cAT
06-14-2014, 08:44 AM
I worked for GM, and more often than not, they bent over backwards for their customers......thought I was a pretty good tech, with a high skill level.....enjoyed working for a dealership.......the practices you mentioned, would not be allowed in our shop.....I have never seen anyone break parts to jack up a bill....if you've seen this, you should have not only reported it to the SM but also to GM Customer Service.......

As I said before, there are good dealerships, and bad ones.....GM, Toyota, Chrysler, Ford, etc.

Normal maintenance, you can just about go anywhere......driveability problems, I would always go to a dealer and ask for their top Tech....

As I said before, if you think work was done wrong complain.....even in the editorial section of your local newspaper......but, as a GM tech, I take exception when someone comes here on this site, and lumps every GM dealership as trying to screw the customer.....I took pride in my work, and I always spread myself around the shop, if guys ran into problems.....SM's I worked for were honest and fair.....

The object of ANY business, is to make money....but not by screwing the public......that practice will cause you to lose business quickly, by word of mouth....

my family members had a auto repair business. the stories of dealerships overcharging and replacing parts for increasing the profit is real stuff.

because he was an honest and trusted repair shop owner / tech he had complete control over the handling of any repair issues . 3 employees. 35 years .

he at times had to turn customers away he was that busy. I usually had to wait a few days when I used his servicing . He made a good amount of income and the customers missed his closing as it was old age setting in.

tomj76
06-20-2014, 11:06 AM
I understand what you're saying Tech II, but requiring that owners be "loyal service customers" to get good service is an unfair extortion practice, and a violation of Ford & GM corporate policies.

Tech II
06-21-2014, 10:57 AM
What I am saying to you is, say you are a steady customer for a dealership, that you bought your car from.....you have your oil changes and maintenance done by them....

Now let's say another person only comes to that dealership for recalls....both have the same vehicle...both have the same mileage....

Now let's say, both vehicles are out of warranty by 6 months......both develop a problem that needs to be fixed......the SM can easily go to bat for the guy who has regular maintenance records with his shop that he can show to GM, where as, he has no records with the other guy....maybe he can get GM to foot the bill or part of the bill for the guy with the records.....the other guy, he has no idea how he maintains his car.....

For example, we had a guy come in with a pulsation......normally, GM would not turn rotors under warranty, after 12 months......this guy had about 20K on his car, and had his tire rotations done on schedule at the shop....The SM could point this out to his area rep, and he would ok the turning for free......someone else coming in with the same mileage, and same problem, but didn't have service records with that shop, the SM can do nothing for him, because he doesn't know who did the tire rotations, and if proper procedures were followed(torque stick/torque wrench/star pattern).....for GM, proper torquing was the main culprit of rotor pulsations, and they weren't going to take the word of some other shop....

As an example, I was at a chain store and saw someone getting new tires put on......zip, zip, zip, zip, zip......impact gun, tightening the lug nuts in a circle instead of a star pattern....so it happens....

You can only police your own shop, not somebody else's......I pointed that out to the Service Writer and he looked at me like I had two heads....

j cAT
06-23-2014, 08:59 AM
The guessing by the dealership of the tire store not torquing the wheels correctly is just a good guess based on how some of these stores operate will low skilled workers with defective tools not calibrated on a regular basis. rotor damage can be from many things including defective calipers,pads, and hardware .

the cutting of the rotors is not a recommended service as GM recommends. Gm service manual states that any cutting of the rotors will reduce the braking effort as the brake pads wear and also make the rotors more susceptible to rotor distortions .

The use of air guns to install wheels is a method that is not recommended. the use of worn sockets also will cause great amount of stress when you need to replace a tire on the side of the road. when I get tires put on I tell them not to use the air gun to install the lug nuts and not to torque the wheels to the spec torque. in the parking lot I use my torque wrench to set this correctly. I have also allowed the tire shop to use MY socket to reduce any lug hardware damage. if the rotor is distorted by improper torque it should be replaced. IMO....

if a regular customer has his oil changes / tire rotations done on a schedule and the rotors are distorted because of the GM/dealership tech over/improper toquing of the wheel hardware the dealership should be responsible especially if this brake issue occurred shortly after the rotations....I guess some dealerships would do the right thing / most will not ...

I had a case where the park brakes did not work. 20,000 mi on it. I inspected the issue and found the shoes worn 50%. took to dealership. tech adjusted the park brake cable . the vehicle had a self adjusting cable mechanism. 2,000mi later I brought the vehicle back and they then said it was because the shoes were worn . I said I never use the park brake how can they be worn out in 22,000 mi...??

after an investigation my effort. I found the the park brake hold down clip was defective this allowed these shoes to wear out and the inner rotor drum . so even when in warranty I had to pay for new shoes/rotor/and the aftermarket hold down clip that was modified to keep the shoes from wearing.. 11 years later the same shoes are still working ..

GM had a recall only on stick vehicles even though the auto tranny had the same parts/brake ...10 years later GM was sued and lost . If you still had the vehicle and your repair costs you could get some money back. NHTSA was notified and was aware that these brakes were defective but did nothing about it. it took a class action lawsuit to get GM to act.

I doubt the NEW GM will handle these type issues any differently. remember vehicle defect is not an allow word in the GM corp ....Also NHTSA is another failed federal governmental agency that just gives jobs to political supporters.

to get anything done with defects you need a few deaths then they might look at the problem. GM and the other manufactures trash the independent repair shops and also keep from these shops all the vehicle defect history data . these TSB reports are not public info. many of these could be used to prevent deaths due to vehicle component defects . I hope that soon the owners of vehicles will get acess to this info and the repair shop working the vehicle by simply inserting the VIN # and the TSB list from these auto makers will be shown.

also any TSB that is safety rated should be sent to the vehicle owner as soon as possible..

tomj76
07-09-2014, 06:36 PM
I suppose the fairness of the policies is debatable, but in the end a few people feel that the warranty is not fully honored and the reasons seem like manufactured opportunities to shift the responsibility for the problem to the vehicle owner.

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