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4 speed Tranny stays in 2nd


Hellcatbyte
06-07-2005, 08:05 AM
4 SPEED AUTO-TRANNY VOYAGER 1997 3.3 (47,000 miles original)

Good Morning everybody:

Can someone tell me If they have had Tranny weird performance with their 4 speed?

My Voyager does behave weird when I step on the accelerator, that is if I'm in a hurry, and step to the floor the accelerator and let go and stop (in city traffic) the tranny satys in 2nd gear! and it stays in that gear, until (I recently discover) I stop, switch it off and restart the engine, that seems to "fix" the problem and if I step hard, but not too hard it works fine, until I force it to change from low to hig abruptly.

I know it is not a linkage problem, I wonder what it is?

Has anybody have had this kind of problem, and how they fixed it?
Any input will be greatly appreciated

regards :screwy:

From Monterrey Mexico

GTP Dad
06-07-2005, 07:03 PM
You have an internal transmission problem and need to take it to a tranny shop to have it diagnosed. Probably a bad shift solenoid. When you step hard on the pedal it is not shifting properly and going into limp mode, staying in second. When you restart the car it resets and works properly again.

Hellcatbyte
06-09-2005, 08:50 AM
You have an internal transmission problem and need to take it to a tranny shop to have it diagnosed. Probably a bad shift solenoid. When you step hard on the pedal it is not shifting properly and going into limp mode, staying in second. When you restart the car it resets and works properly again.

Thanks GTP dad I was trying to avoid the shop, as in mexico, they just say "you need a new transmission", without going trough the trouble to analize the tranny, is there a book regarding this speed tranny? I'm kind handy with tools, and used to rebuild old cars back in the 70's but age 63 and the law of gravity has put me out of intensive action, but I thought it could be related to "tune up"?
Regards

GTP Dad
06-09-2005, 06:22 PM
I am not certain whether there is a book on the market for this particular transmission or not. Since the transmission is electronically controlled I believe you have a bad solenoid that can be easily replaced it just takes the right scanner to find out which one. I have only, at least as of today, had three experiences with tranny shops. One was for what I thought was a bad tranny and he told me it was an engine miss which it proved to be. The other two were for transmission replacements due to major problems. I went to AAMCO and they were very straight with me and I felt treated me very well. In fact one was a 97 T&C Van. The tranny was totally toast which I new before I sent it. The last was a Pontiac Grand Prix and the tranny was trashed too. On the latter they gave me a three year warranty at no extra charge since I was a repeat customer.

I understand your reluctance to go to a tranny shop but you can always tell them just to diagnose it and not to do any repairs without your permission. With these new transmissions I think that may be the better course of action.

Hellcatbyte
06-09-2005, 10:19 PM
Thanks I'll do that, problem is, there are no AAMCO Tranny shops in Mexico, but I think I know of one reliable source and I'll try it.
I'll keep you posted

caravandrvr
06-10-2005, 08:29 AM
I wouldn't rule out an electronic issue at this point though. The thing is why does the problem "correct" itself after the car is turned off and then restarted. Sounds like a classic electronic issue - think windows locks up and you reboot. I've seen similar issues corrected by changing the ECM, but it could also be possibly a sensor.

Hellcatbyte
06-10-2005, 10:00 AM
I wouldn't rule out an electronic issue at this point though. The thing is why does the problem "correct" itself after the car is turned off and then restarted. Sounds like a classic electronic issue - think windows locks up and you reboot. I've seen similar issues corrected by changing the ECM, but it could also be possibly a sensor.

Thanks again I will consider all your thoughts about this isue with the tranny.

On the other hand I have to find out why the exaust pipe has a soot ring about 1/4 wide around the very exit pipe, it stains the finger, this must mean that raw gas is bypassing something, but to be honest I fill the tank, I think it is 15 gallons and it drives me from Monterrey MX to San Antonio TX 325 miles and I still have a 1/4 tank at arrival so why the soot?
Anyway I'm all confused, this is my very first experience with a Voyager 97 engine 3.3 all my previous cars were 4 cyl. Neon, and Spirit
Regards

jamalnemah
08-17-2005, 11:04 PM
Hi, How are you today.

I had the same problem. Tranny goes into 2nd when i pass 30 MPH. I took it to the tranny shop and told i need a new tranny. i did not accept that.

i read the answers you posted and changed the shift solenoid and cleared the codes it run good for 3 miles then check engine came back. the mechanic said change tranny. i already paid him $200.

i took it to a new tranny shop. the mechanic put it in the computer but could not read any thing. he said i have an electric problem. he drove it and the RPM start to fluctuate. while driving the car he put it in Nuteral turned the engine of then turn it back on and drove the car for 25 miles and had no problems the voyager was changing gear perfectly.

we stoped and turn the van off. we started driving it back the problem started all over again. the mechanic said it is an electrical problem for sure.

at the shop he hooked the van to the computer and this time it gave him some codes.

the first code was 41: shift Solenoid mulfunction.
I told him i put a new one. he said it must be Electrical.


my transmission had no metal deposits in it. it was clean.


what do you think. please help

KManiac
08-17-2005, 11:56 PM
The Chrysler 4-speed automatic, known as the Ultradrive, is an electronic, computer controlled transmission. These transmissions are designed to self-program your shift points to match your driving habits, that is how smart they are. The logic circuits are constantly monitoring transmission performance. When ever it electronically detects instantaneous anomolies in performance, the controller will electronically default to "limp mode", which is continuous second gear. Turning off the car and restarting will clear the "limp mode" until another anomoly is detected. Error codes are kept on the dianostic computer. An occasional drop to limp mode is nothing to worry about. Repeated drops into limp mode means that you have a problem of some type inside the transmission, either electrical, mechanical or both.

My experience with these are limited to my wife's former van, a 1989 Dodge Caravan SE (3.0 L) and our current 1998 Chrysler Town & Country LX AWD (3.8 L). One day, in a heavy rainstorm, the 1989 dropped into "limp mode" once. I reset the transmission the usual way and it returned to normal. This occurred about 40,000 miles after the last rebuild. We drove the van another 40,000 miles before selling it and it never dropped into "limp mode" again. We have owned the 1998 for almost six years, buying it used with only 9,000 miles on the clock. It now has 81,000 miles and we have never experienced "limp mode" with this transmission.

Oh, I almost forgot another Dodge van I drove. This one was a 1992 Caravan with 3.0 L and automatic. This one was for sale by owner and had 159,000 on the odometer. Two miles into the test drive, while driving down a city street at a constant 30 mph, I got a sense of a strange feeling from the van and noticed the tach was at 2500 rpm. After stopping at the next traffic light and taking off, I realized the van had dropped into limp mode. I pulled the van over, reset it and continued my drive. I took the van on the freeway and it ran just fine. Ten miles later, while returning to the start of the test drive, cruising at a steady 35 mph, it dropped into limp mode again. I returned the van to the starting point, thanked the owner and walked away.

Another interesting feature of the transmission in my 1998 I noticed soon after buying the van. There is a local freeway here that has a 4-5% downgrade for over a mile. One two separate occasions, while driving this stretch of freeway, I had the cruise control set at 65 mph. When I reached this downgrade, the van began to gain speed going downhill. When the speedometer reached 75 mph (just coasting in gear) the transmission downshifted to third gear! It automatically upshifted when the speedometer reached 65 mph. It only did this when the cruise control was set! Now that's what I call a smart transmission! Has anyone else experience this with their modern Ultradrive?

Hellcatbyte
08-18-2005, 08:00 AM
Well to be honest I just got back from a 1,200 miles trip and the Tranny behave really good except once, it went on "limp mode" only once while downshifting to pass a car on the high way at about 80 miles an hour, ite really reved up so I had to pull over, stop and switch off the van, waited one minute, restared and kept driving without any further alarums.

SO, there must be something electric! hum....

When using the Cruise control and go down hill, it just decelerates and accelerate when going up hill, it does not shift unless there is a rather steep up hill, but going down hill, it just decelerates and accelerate to preserve the previously set speed.

B33p3r
08-18-2005, 12:32 PM
I'm by no means an automotive authority but from all the reading I've done I think you should check all your ground points to the tranny. Check the grounding straps, unscrew them, clean them so you have bare metal to bare metal and try again. It may save you some bucks. Check for loose wires on the solenoid connectors also.

ZPI28
08-18-2005, 11:27 PM
4 SPEED AUTO-TRANNY VOYAGER 1997 3.3 (47,000 miles original)

Good Morning everybody:

Can someone tell me If they have had Tranny weird performance with their 4 speed?

My Voyager does behave weird when I step on the accelerator, that is if I'm in a hurry, and step to the floor the accelerator and let go and stop (in city traffic) the tranny satys in 2nd gear! and it stays in that gear, until (I recently discover) I stop, switch it off and restart the engine, that seems to "fix" the problem and if I step hard, but not too hard it works fine, until I force it to change from low to hig abruptly.

I know it is not a linkage problem, I wonder what it is?

Has anybody have had this kind of problem, and how they fixed it?
Any input will be greatly appreciated

regards :screwy:

From Monterrey Mexico

My 96 GC is doing the same thing, but mine is giving the P0715 speed sensor error. I purchase a new one today for $21 and will install it tomorrow then reset the computer. I am also doing a new filter and fluid while im under there. Ill let ya know how it works out for me.

Steven

Oh yeah, Ive worked in Monterrey some, over at Montoi Mattel.

Hellcatbyte
08-19-2005, 07:12 AM
My 96 GC is doing the same thing, but mine is giving the P0715 speed sensor error. I purchase a new one today for $21 and will install it tomorrow then reset the computer. I am also doing a new filter and fluid while im under there. Ill let ya know how it works out for me.

Steven

Oh yeah, Ive worked in Monterrey some, over at Montoi Mattel.

Please do and yes, Mattel, the Toy factory that is in Santa Catarina Ive been there too.

Rene

jamalnemah
08-20-2005, 11:11 PM
I unplugged the battery today and plugged it back. The service engine soon was cleared. but it reappeared after I drove the van for 2 mile. I had no problem while the service engine soon was gone. but now i am back to square one.

reconbyfire82
08-22-2005, 09:03 AM
Sounds like an issue you find on the lh cars also. Try changing the output sensor on the transmission its only like 25 bucks. good luck

jamalnemah
08-23-2005, 08:49 PM
hi,

i took the car to the Mechanic today. i left it there for about 8 hours.
after i called him he said i need a new transmission.
i still don't believe him.
he said:I hook the tranny to special tranny tools. the third geard did not work.
i asked him why it works when i turn the car off the start again. he said something about the overdrive kicking in.


I don't know why the overdrive does not kick in when i start driving the first time?

any ways

any suggestions?

caleb_wiley
08-24-2005, 10:22 PM
I just heard about this site and I can't tell you how thrilled I am about it. Even if there are no replies to this post, I've already learned alot from many of you. Thanks for all the input. Now...down to business...

The Background:
I've got a 1994 Plymouth Grand Voyager with a 3.3L engine and a 4-speed tranny with overdrive.

I got the van at 110,000 miles and in the last year have put an additional 40,000 miles on it (most of them highway).

According to the previous owner (a friend of mine who I trust), the transmission was rebuilt at roughly 50,000 miles and serviced right before I got it. I have not serviced it since then. The fluid is clean although I'm not sure if it is the ATF+3. The field seems pretty split between those who think that it matters and those who think it's the dealership's way to make more money.

I had to replace the left half-shaft seal at about 125,000 miles. Other than that, the tranny has been solid.

The Problem
The transmission has developed a love affair with the ever infamous "limp mode".

The first time it occured was while I was at a stop sign. I felt a shudder and when I got onto the road noticed the tach revving too high. Pulled off immediately and reset the computer by disconnecting the battery. This took it out of limp mode and I had no problems for another (roughly) 1,200 miles.

It has now occured for a second time and I haven't been so lucky with the quick fix. The reset does work, but only for a short distance, no more than 6-7 miles.

The Attempted Fixes
1) Reset Computer - no good

2) Checked all solenoid wiring harnesses for corrosion and/or loose wires. Everything seems clean and solid.

3) Had two different mechanics (independant, not dealer) attempt to diagnose the codes - the only problem is that the van computer is not giving their testers ANY codes (Incidentally, the check engine light is NOT on). I've been told that in order to have it tested properly, I need to take it to the dealership. I'm skeptical but willing to give it a shot if there's any truth to this contention.

I have had two mechanics (close friends) who I trust completely tell me that it is most likely an internal mechanical failure caused simply by normal wear and tear. This has been backed up by a third mechanic (who I trust much less).
However, a fourth mechanic (who I don't know personally but who has an outstanding reputation for both honesty and competence among my friends in the town I'm stranded in) believes that it is most likely an external component problem. To me, the van is not worth investing $2K for a rebuild but if I could work my way through a less costly external fix I would love to keep it. I'm pretty handy with most mechanical things, but when it comes to transmissions, I'm in the dark. Any input from you guys would be great. Thanks in advance.

Caleb Wiley

Hellcatbyte
08-25-2005, 12:50 PM
I have not fixed the problem, It is not a frecuent fault, it comes, say, when I step really hard on the acclerator, and maybe once every 2 months or so, but as I said if the fault occurs, I just pull aside, or not even pull aside I put it in neutral, I just switch off, and wait for the tachometer to drop to "0" and on again and the problem goes away, I have driven more than 3,000 miles with the problem high way and city and I just do the "routine" when it happens, but I can say that the problem has struck maybe 4 times in a the lapse of 5 months.

We in Monterrey Mexico, about 120 miles south of the border of Laredo TX have as you Americans have, Junk yards and went to ask for a 4 speed trany for my 1997 Voyager (the short) 3.3 engine and they gave me a 500.00 US/DLLS (five hundred) no core required 3 month garantee trans working and in perfect condition, (all voyagers and grand voyagers and all Chrysler vans and some cars are IMPORTED from USA)

But I said well I'll wait to gather some $$$, or if the problem becomes acute.

And as we say $$$$$$ does not grows on trees, I just drive carefully and not overstep the gas pedal, I mean I can step the pedal to the bottom, but not ram it to the bottom if I do, that's when it happens, if you know what I mean

jamalnemah
08-25-2005, 08:35 PM
Hi,

a new development in my Grand Voyager 97 tranny.

I decided today to change my driving habits. instead of pressing hard on the gas padle i pressed gently. gave the car time to build up speed and after 3 miles of driving the "service Engine" light went off.
what a relief. the car shifted to the 3rd gear and was driving nice.
i was so happy.

so, I told my self let me test the transmission. after a stop sign, i pressed hard on the gas padle the RPM went to 300 and what do you know the tranny went to a limp mode. and the check engine came back.

i stoped. turn the car off then on drove it gently and after few miles the check engine sign was gone. the problem with this kind of gentle driving is that you can't make any sudden acceleration if i am not over 40 MPH other wise the car will go to a limp mode.

any new development?

jamalnemah
08-26-2005, 12:15 PM
anyone knows the location of the ground strap?

everyone check this
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=196775&highlight=Transmission

busta9876
08-30-2005, 07:56 PM
almost every post i read these tranny's are hitting limp mode when mashing down on the gas, or going from a stop.

when you do that the engine and tranny twists in its motor mounts and wires move about. any loose connections will cause problems.

I work for a major remanufacturing company that builds A604 transmissions. 50% of our warranty calls are electrical problems.

being that the transmission is completely electronically controlled, any problem the computer gives up and goes into limp mode.

I think I can safely says most A604 transmission that has an intermintant "limp mode" condition and other times works in all 4 forward gears + lockup does NOT have an internal concern.

Limp mode is the default gear if all power was lost to the transmission. you can test this by unplugging the solenoid pack. you will have Park, Revers, and 2nd Gear, that will be it.

all shifting is controlled by 4 solenoids in the solenoid pack. the computer commands these On and Off to apply the clutches to make 4 forward gears and lockup. the compture relies on the speed sensors for shift timing and your speed-o-meter.

always check your codes. limp mode with no codes almost has to be electrical problem, loose connections

speed sensor codes can be in the harness or sometimes the sensor. if installing new sensor in a 1998 or older vehicle, the plug might be different. mopar changed the plug in 1998. the old one will install with some force, but will fail .

pressure switch codes can result from internal valve body problems. there are 3 pressure switches ( part of solenoid pack)

there some stuff to read about email me with any questions.

caleb_wiley
08-31-2005, 07:00 PM
The last post sums up what I've been suspicious of but not certain of.

"I think I can safely says most A604 transmission that has an intermintant "limp
mode" condition and other times works in all 4 forward gears + lockup does
NOT have an internal concern. always check your codes. limp mode with no
codes almost has to be electrical problem, loose connections"

My Plymouth goes into "limp mode" with no pattern that I've been able to ascertain and has no codes that any mechanic I've brought it to has been able to find. However, during the intermittent periods of time in which the tranny is NOT in "limp mode" the van runs like a champ. Unfortunately for me, transmission problems make me cringe and ELECTRICAL transmission problems make me want to huddle in a corner with my thumb in my mouth. I just don't have a decent enough working knowledge about trannies to know where to go from here. Any input? I'd appreciate it. Thanks.

ps. I tried to e-mail you (the guy who posted the quote above) through the forum but was denied access. If you want to e-mail me directly, you can use the link below. Thanks.

Caleb Wiley

caleb_wiley@hotmail.com

jamalnemah
08-31-2005, 10:05 PM
I have talked to a guy called Miguell about my transmission problem and he E-mailed me a file about transmission code 41.

after reading it i found out it had nothing to do with mechanical problem but it was all electrical.

if you are interested in his email to me i will be happy to forward it to you. it has a lot of diagrams and insite.

his reply was in reguards to 97 plymouth Grand Voyager SE 3.3

jamalnemah
09-08-2005, 10:01 AM
I took my car to a Mechanic (I trust his honesty) 2 days ago. (((He is the one who change the Solenoid Shift to fix the limp-in in my transmission but that didn't fix the problem))). I gave him the diagrams I got from Miguel. He followed the instruction step by step. and we fixed the problem. it took him about an 2 hours to fix the whole problem.
it was not a grounding problem. but it was electrical.

for the ones who emailed me to get the diagrams.
we inspected wire # 53, 57 (grounding) and 20 in the TCM. the Ohms in wire # 20 was about 0.2 it was suppose to be 5.0 ohms.
my friend the Mechanic cut wire #20 and made an outside connection to wire #7 (the Femal plug located in the L-R solenoid above the Solenoid shift).
i drove the car and problem is fixed.
today is my 3rd happy day. i didn't have to worry about going into a limp-in mode.

by the Way. anyone can do this it is so simple. of course this after the fact.


by the way i have about 50-60 transmission codes and with the causes. i got it from AAMCO. i hope, when i have the time to help to put them for everyone to read.

i have enlisted in an online Mechanic school becuase i am sick and tired of people cheating me.

good luck everyone.

i hope this little info. helped somebody.

My thanks goes to Miguel which without his inside info i would have paid about $1000-$1800.

and special thank to the input from the members of this site which led me to Miguel.

thanks everybody.

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