A/c Quit Working, Confused...

I have a 94 Honda Accord, and today the A/C just stopped blowing cold air. I have kept complete maintainence records, so below is what has happened. If anyone can tell me what might be the cause, it would really help. Thanks!!

6/27/2002 -- RECHARGE A/C SYSTEM, REPLACE DISH HOSE & SUCTION HOSE (AND ADJUST), REPLACE COMPRESSOR ASSEMBLY, DRIER

5/10/2004 -- REPLACE AC CONDENSER, RECEIVER DRYER PIPE, COOLANT TEMP SENSOR, 20OZ FREON 143A

5/28/2005 -- A/C STOPS BLOWING COLD AIR :(

Some other things I've noticed:

1. Today when I started the A/C, it smelled like manure. I checked this at different locations in town, and the same thing. Only when I first start it, for a minute or so.

2. I can hear a hissing noise when it goes on and off. Seems to be coming from the passenger side door vent.

I can't find the sight glass. Does anyone know where it is on a 94 honda accord?

Sounds like your evap core drain is blocked, and the core is swimming in doopy water. The hissing sound may be the blower wheel paddling water.

The drain is under the car, near the rear of the engine compartment. Usually looks like a small piece of hose coming out of the body, roughly below your glove box. They usually have a "pinched" end, so water goes out, but bugs and dirt don't get in. sometimes the rubber sticks together, or a spider gets in there, or algea clogs it, etc. You have to open it up so it can drain. Run someting up through it (don't punch a hole in the core, just need to go a couple of inches into it), and be prepared to get wet when it opens!

i also noticed today that water was gushing out of the area you just mentioned. i checked it and it looked like dirty water. it wasn't just dripping but really flowing from the underside onto the pavement. it was quite a hot day today here in florida.

Is the water flowing out of the drain with the airconditioner running? Or is it always running? Water is made when the airconditioner is running properly in humid climates. If you are getting water but not cold air, check the heater valve position. If it is on, you will get dry hot air.

i just read somewhere on another site that it said the air blowing out will stink if the evaporator isn't evaporating...because mold grows on the evaporator coil. this could explain the smell i was talking about. but i was seeing lots of water flowing out onto the ground...what gives?

Is the water flowing out of the drain with the airconditioner running? Or is it always running? Water is made when the airconditioner is running properly in humid climates. If you are getting water but not cold air, check the heater valve position. If it is on, you will get dry hot air.

i'll have to more throroughly check it tomorrow. but i remember that today i turned it off and it was still flowing. i didn't leave it off long enough to be honest. i will try turning it off longer tomorrow.

where is the heater valve and how do i determine its position. i WAS getting DRY hot air!

Hope you aren't seeing rusty coolant going out of the core...

See if your A/C clutch stays engaged with the air on, and if the line to the evap are cold and sweating. If so, you got trouble of some kind with the core, or heat control valve, like mpumas said.

the only reason you'd have flow from the core drain like that is

A. the A/c is working fine, and the evaporator core is sweating like crazy because it is cold, or

B. The heater core is leaking (which will smell weird too, especially if the coolant is rusty)

The water leaking out of the core should be quite cold. Is it?

not sure. i will see tomorrow. should i be touching the water if refrigerant might be in it?

If nothing else, I have occaisionally seen one with a partly blocked drain that drips, but when you run something up through it, you get a rush of water and crud that was trapped and just seeping out. You don't have wet carpet under the pass floor mat, do you?

no, no leaking inside car. that's why i'm really confused...

Refrig isn't water soluable. It's an aerosol, will just evaporate into the air. All you should have coming out is water.

I know when I've been down in FL, when it's real humid they'll sweat water in a steady stream rather than just dripping like they do here. If conditions are like that, and the core can't drain fast enough, it'll fill up quick. That could (possibly) explain why it stinks when you first start it. As it sits, the core drains, and you are left with a wet mass of growing mold that starts becoming more active as the remaining dampness warms up.

Same way a creek stinks after the water goes down.

The big thing is, if you have a cold sweaty low pressure line going into the firewall, and a hot return, the system is working right, so you are left with a flooded core, heat contamination from a control valve problem, etc.

Sorry I keep asking so many uestions, but this is interesting to me, for some reason.

Did the air stop working suddenly, like something broke, or just slowly crap out?

Is the air blowing from the vents sufficient? It's blowing strong, just not cold, right?

Are both fans on the radiator running when the a/c clutch is engaged?

Is the a/c clutch engaging?

again, where is the heater valve and how do i determine its position? what is wierd is that the A/C was really cold a few days ago. doesn't seem like a leak...

I'm not familiar enough with your car to tell you exactly, but in general it will be in one of the coolant hoses going into the firewall, generally has a vacuum line or cable going to it, and you can see the mechanism changing position on some of them as you change from heat to cool. If you can't locate it, another check is just to see if one heater hose is signifigantly warmer than the other when the motor has been running for a few minutes. The valve shuts off coolant flow to the heater core, and the return hose should be cool (no circulation) when the heater control valve is closed. The supply side will be the same temp as the radiator hose, more or less.

The big thing is, if you have a cold sweaty low pressure line going into the firewall, and a hot return, the system is working right, so you are left with a flooded core, heat contamination from a control valve problem, etc.

Sorry I keep asking so many uestions, but this is interesting to me, for some reason.

Did the air stop working suddenly, like something broke, or just slowly crap out?

Is the air blowing from the vents sufficient? It's blowing strong, just not cold, right?

Are both fans on the radiator running when the a/c clutch is engaged?

Is the a/c clutch engaging?

yes, the a/c was working yesterday, this morning it was slightly cool, and by the end of the day it was hot. you could actually turn the heater knob and it would get hotter, but the cold wasn't cold, it was definitely hot.

air is blowing strong. just not cold anymore.

the engine rpms go down when i turn on the a/c, so i'm assuming the clutch is engaging. 3 days ago i had my honda's idle rpm adjusted a bit higher, because the engine would shake when the a/c went on (because the rpms would drop too low -- this happened over a longer period of time, but got so bad that we upped the rpms to fix this).

another problem i had that i haven't fixed was that the 2nd fan wouldn't come on unless i had the a/c on. sitting at idle, the car would overheat if the a/c wasn't turned on. i think i was told it was the cooling sensor or relay switch.

Do both fans run with the A/C on, though?

The secondary fan will only run when the A/C is on, that's normal. but you shouldn't overheat unless the primary fan isn't working at idle. If it isn't, then there is a problem with the relay or sensor, yes.

well, i haven't watched the fans yet. i notice the temp gauge goes up after at idle and engine has been running hard like on a highway. soon as i turn on the a/c (and the a/c button must be on, not just the "fan"), the temp gauge shows the engine temp coming back down to "normal". only thing i could think of would be one of the fans doesn't come on like it should unless i have the a/c on. maybe i'm wrong. but that seems like a totally different problem, no?

OK. We gotta find out if the low pressure side line is getting cold, the heater valve is shut, and both fans working with A/C on.

I believe on yours the primary fan is the passenger's side, and the aux fan is the other one.

You are right, it sounds like the compressor is working.

It may be that the A/C system itself developed a blockage. That would cause both the loss of cooling, the increasing load from the A/C on your idle, but then it shouldn't be producing sweat from the core drain.

Man, I love a good mystery. Let me know more tomorrow.

It wasn't retrofitted to use 134A refrigerant when all that work was done, was it?

well, i haven't watched the fans yet. i notice the temp gauge goes up after at idle and engine has been running hard like on a highway. soon as i turn on the a/c (and the a/c button must be on, not just the "fan"), the temp gauge shows the engine temp coming back down to "normal". only thing i could think of would be one of the fans doesn't come on like it should unless i have the a/c on. maybe i'm wrong. but that seems like a totally different problem, no?

Yes and no, depends how high the temp goes as you sit. My own car will go as far as 2/3 or more up thje gauge before the primary fan comes on in hot weather, that's normal for it. If the A/C is on (both fans running) it sits rock-steady at 1/3 no matter what the conditions. So you will see cycling of temp with the a/c off, because the primary fan only runs on demand, and the temp has to reach a set point before it kicks on, then the temp should slowly return to it's previous level.

i don't think 94 honda accords had r-12. ok, i will check the fans tomorrow. i don't know if i will be able to find the low pressure side line or the heater valve. i couldn't even find the sight today...man do i need a friend who knows engines :)

OK, I forgot yours was that new. General layout of an a/c system:

Compressor (you know where that is)

1 line out to the receiver (big aluminum round can) and on to the evaporator core (goes into the firewall)

1 line out of the firewall to the condenser (in front of the radiator)

1 line from the condensor back to the compressor

Low pressure (cold) side hoses and lines are generally bigger.

Everyhing from the compressor to the firewall should be cold and sweating with the system on. Everything from the firewall back to the compressor (condensor side, high pressure) will be hot, (very)



If not, something is wrong.

The heater control valve is located in the engine compartment on the passenger side firewall. A wire is attached to the valve which goes to the heater control knob on the heater control panel. When you turn the knob you should see the valve move. If it doesn't move, it may have become disconnected on the heater panel. Or maybe the heater valve is leaking. You can manually move the lever on the valve to open or close it.

The heater control valve is located in the engine compartment on the passenger side firewall. A wire is attached to the valve which goes to the heater control knob on the heater control panel. When you turn the knob you should see the valve move. If it doesn't move, it may have become disconnected on the heater panel. Or maybe the heater valve is leaking. You can manually move the lever on the valve to open or close it.

come to think of it, i have moved the heater knob (i think i said this in a post earlier), and the temp did change from hot to hotter. so i think it is working (maybe not all the way though?)

i'll see what i can see

and i have had problems with the heater valve in the past...maybe this is it again?

OK, assuming the car has been sitting all night, if the heater is mixing with your A/C air, the a/c should work fine until the car starts to warm up. Cold motor=no heat, so the air should be cold and get warmer as the engine warms up.

Gotta see if the A/C clutch is engaging. Don't know how familiar you are with the compressor, but here's the scoop. The clutch on the face of the a/c comp pulley sits unmoving until the comp engages, then it turns with the pulley. It should engage, and stay engaged. Short cycling (clutching in and out rapidly) indicates refrigerant loss.

Both fans should come one when the clutch engages, or else there is some concern there.

Within a few seconds of engagement, you should be able to see a cold line move down the low pressure line coming from the compressor out to the interior of the car (sweat or frost).

ok, i checked it out. the heater valve is working correctly. the fans (both of them) NEVER turn on. the compressor doesn't turn on. the clutch never turns. the lines are not cold/hot.

i'm thinking a leak somewhere. because the air was cold, then cool, then hot yesterday. i'm worried that by messing with the throttle body area, we bumped a hose or something and caused the leak. its too coincidental.

i'm going to take it back to the place where i had the throttle body adjustment and tell them what i found out.

shouldn't at least 1 fan be running though when i have the car running? that might be another problem, who knows.

Only when the temp gets up to 1/2 or more. Otherwise, the fan will be off.

Yes, sounds like you leaked it out, wonder if that's what you heard near the passenger's vent?
mighta blown a pinhole in the evap core.

Doesn't sound like real good news, seems like everything else has been replaced recently.

Still curious about the smell. r134a is not a smell I recognize, because it dissapates so fast into air, it's hard to get a concentration high enough to get a snort. I wonder if it was leaking into the core box and laying in there trapped until the blower came on? Or it might be the glycol oil in the system leaking out with the refrig that you smelled.

Anyway, a shop with a refrigerant sniffer can shoot a little charge in the system, and if they detect r134a at the vents, that's where the problem is.

Hopefully there might be a better, cheaper answer.

well that sucks if its the evaporator. i will take it in next week and see what the diagnosis is. thanks for your help!!

also, the water wasn't dripping at all now....looks like the system just shut itself off.

Check fuses for the airconditioner clutch. It is a 7.5 amp fuse. It gets its power from the ignition switch. Also, there is a pressure switch in the refrigant line that will shut the compressor off is the refrigant pressure drops too low/high.

should i first try to use a r134a refill kit from target? wouldn't this save me $$?? then i could at least find out if there is a leak?

You could shoot it, and see what happens. Problem is, if it quit because a blockage was causing abnormally high pressure, you might just blow a hose or seize the compressor. I think a leak is most likely, but you wouldn't actually be doing anything but verifying this, which the shop will do anyway. If you lost the whole system charge in a day, you aren't gonna get any use out of it by charging.

Sometimes a very high pressure event will rupture the safety blow-off (if it has one), and vent all the refrigerant. This is a possibility too.

ok, well i went down to target, picked up some 143a 19oz can of refrigerant, with a pressure gauge on it. i removed the "L" cap (there is a "H" cap for high, "L" for low), and put the hose on it. the pressure said low. I started to fill the system and whalla the compressor, and fans kicked on -- scared me! :) i continued to fill until it was near the top of the filled zone on the gauge. the system seemed to always come back to about the middle of this area on the gauge. I tried to fill it a couple of times above this level, but it always came back. i think the system has a overflow valve or something?

i am going out to check it again in a bit. i want to see if the system is leaking and how fast. its possible that the system was just slowly leaking since last year, and finally it kicked off. who knows. but for $20 not a bad loss if its a fast leak. at least i will have not wasted my time.

the procedure was very quick and easy. i recommend it to anyone whose a/c seems to be low, or slowly leaking. $20 a year wouldn't be a problem if that is what is was (i'm hoping!).

An update on the A/C problem. 10 days ago I filled the system up to 35 p.s.i., which was the middle of the green zone on the gauge I spoke of. Today I checked it, and it was at 30 p.s.i.

So the question is do I have a leak or is this just the equilibrium of the system. And if I DO have a leak, is it going to continue at the rate of .5 p.s.i. / day, or will it slow down as the p.s.i. gets lower.

Also, is there a leak test kit that I can purchase somewhere? I'd rather not pay $150 for a mechanic to test it if I can do this myself.

I will run the A/C again for 10 days (it gets ALOT of work down here in Florida, especially lately!), and check the p.s.i. again. I'm hoping that the sealant in the stuff I bought will seal up any leaks and slow down the rate of leaking, if it is leaking.

I can't believe a shop would hit you up for $150 just to run a sniffer over the A/C components. (Well, the DEALER might!)

When you first start shooting refrig in the low side pressure will jump up to around 90 psi or maybe more, but rapidly go back down to around thirty. 30-35 is perfect for low side pressure. Ambient temp has a big effect on system pressures, so if it was cooler when you checked it the second time, you would show a little less pressure.

If you had the gauge on and watched as you sprayed the condensor with cool water from a hose, you'd see it drop another 5 psi or more. I always spray the condesor with water when charging, make it really inhale the refrig fast.

But you wouldn't really be able to tell if you were leaking by pressure, unless you were checking static pressure with the system off and the engine cold, and even then differences in temp would throw it off some. When you shut it off, the pressures on the high and low side equalize, and it'd finally settle to a similar reading on both sides (I don't know what that would be, never tried it).

The only way to check system integrity is to evacuate the whole system and watch the vacuum level for a period of time. Ideally you shouldn't see any drop after an hour or so.

Glad you decided to try that, it might just work for you. The only reason I advised against it was, you seemed to imply that it was working fine right up to the day it quit. As in it went from perfect to nothing in 24 hours. Usually, as the system charge drops, the A/C gets progressively less effective, until it finally reaches threshold for low-pressure cutoff, and stops working. That didn't seem to be the case for you, it sounded more like a catastrophic leak, in which case charging would be a waste of time and money.

Hopefully, it wasn't.

Another question. How much did you shoot in it? There should be a label on the core support or therabouts that gives the specs for the A/C system, including system capacity. Go over capacity, and it may lock the compressor or blow a hose. You think the compressor and fans coming on scared you (it always startles me too, even though I'm waiting for it)....wait till that happens. :eek7: Sounds like a gunshot :eek:

Your system is probably somewhere around three pounds (typical). You can read it and see for sure. If you suppose that the low-pressure cutout occurs around when there is less than a third of system capacity left...you should be careful if adding any more than two 14 oz cans to it. 3-4 is all they usually take even after being completely evacuated. Keep the bottom of the can pointed away from you, it is designed to blow out if the can gets overpressurized.

Hold the can as high as possible, and upside down for fastest intake.

Interesting comments from jeffcoslacker. I agree with most of the infromation provided except holding the can upside down to speed up the charging. When upside down you are charging with liquid vs gas into the compressor. I would think that liquid into the intake side could cause a compressor lockup and blow the valve plates because liquid cannot compress where gas can.

One of the biggest causes of leaks is the front seal of the compressor. The A/C needs to be used frequently or at least every couple of weeks even in the winter to keep the carbon seal wet on the front shaft. Sometimes just using it a lot after recharging can reseat the seal and stop the leak.

Interesting comments from jeffcoslacker. I agree with most of the infromation provided except holding the can upside down to speed up the charging. When upside down you are charging with liquid vs gas into the compressor. I would think that liquid into the intake side could cause a compressor lockup and blow the valve plates because liquid cannot compress where gas can.

.

You are right (in theory), and I have been told that before. However, I've always charged with liquid, and have yet to regret it. Some older ones with a weak compressor have so much trouble pumping, they take forever to pull a charge out of a can unless you flip it over and run the idle up. That's a pretty sorry system, though.

If it takes the can vapor-side easy enough, go ahead and do it that way. I don't wanna mislead.

One of the biggest causes of leaks is the front seal of the compressor. The A/C needs to be used frequently or at least every couple of weeks even in the winter to keep the carbon seal wet on the front shaft. Sometimes just using it a lot after recharging can reseat the seal and stop the leak.

Good point. Kinda like a tire with a slow rim leak. Might take a month to loose 10 psi, but after loosing 15 psi, it's not holding the bead against the rim firmly enough to seal, and goes flat overnight.

Same theory. :iceslolan

thanks for the insight. i guess it could have been different temps when i did the measuring both times. but i did notice a difference in the a/c when i added it back to 35 p.s.i. it was definitely colder.

in florida, the temps don't vary more than 5-10 degrees in the summer, and i did the measuring at the same time of day, but who knows...

i did have someone 4 years ago check a leak with dye -- wonder if i would have to add more dye, or would it still be in there? the first time i refilled, the p.s.i. was pretty low.

one thing i was going to try was to not turn the heater control at all for the first 10 days, and hopefully it wasn't going to leak. but the 5 p.s.i. drop kinda ended that test. my theory was that it was leaking out of the heater control valve somehow when i moved the control, and if i just left it on cold and never turned it, checked the p.s.i., then went 10 days with turning it, and checked the p.s.i., i would see a different result. sounds like the best way to do this is just inject the dye and go over it with a blacklight?

When you first start shooting refrig in the low side pressure will jump up to around 90 psi or maybe more, but rapidly go back down to around thirty. 30-35 is perfect for low side pressure. Ambient temp has a big effect on system pressures, so if it was cooler when you checked it the second time, you would show a little less pressure.

If you had the gauge on and watched as you sprayed the condensor with cool water from a hose, you'd see it drop another 5 psi or more. I always spray the condesor with water when charging, make it really inhale the refrig fast.

But you wouldn't really be able to tell if you were leaking by pressure, unless you were checking static pressure with the system off and the engine cold, and even then differences in temp would throw it off some. When you shut it off, the pressures on the high and low side equalize, and it'd finally settle to a similar reading on both sides (I don't know what that would be, never tried it).

The only way to check system integrity is to evacuate the whole system and watch the vacuum level for a period of time. Ideally you shouldn't see any drop after an hour or so.

Glad you decided to try that, it might just work for you. The only reason I advised against it was, you seemed to imply that it was working fine right up to the day it quit. As in it went from perfect to nothing in 24 hours. Usually, as the system charge drops, the A/C gets progressively less effective, until it finally reaches threshold for low-pressure cutoff, and stops working. That didn't seem to be the case for you, it sounded more like a catastrophic leak, in which case charging would be a waste of time and money.

Hopefully, it wasn't.

The heater control isn't in the refrigerant circuit, so it can't leak that way. In fact the temp control doesn't directly affect the A/C at all - it only changes the hot water circ through the heater core. That's why you can run heat and A/C at the same time in the winter to keep the cabin both warm and dry.

thanks for the insight. i guess it could have been different temps when i did the measuring both times. but i did notice a difference in the a/c when i added it back to 35 p.s.i. it was definitely colder.

in florida, the temps don't vary more than 5-10 degrees in the summer, and i did the measuring at the same time of day, but who knows...

i did have someone 4 years ago check a leak with dye -- wonder if i would have to add more dye, or would it still be in there? the first time i refilled, the p.s.i. was pretty low.

one thing i was going to try was to not turn the heater control at all for the first 10 days, and hopefully it wasn't going to leak. but the 5 p.s.i. drop kinda ended that test. my theory was that it was leaking out of the heater control valve somehow when i moved the control, and if i just left it on cold and never turned it, checked the p.s.i., then went 10 days with turning it, and checked the p.s.i., i would see a different result. sounds like the best way to do this is just inject the dye and go over it with a blacklight?

I've never used the dye, always had access to a sniffer. It should work, but if the leak is behind the firewall in the interior of the car, you won't see anything without digging down to the core.

You are kind of in the dark as far as charging, you really need a high side reading to know what's happening. They will actually run colder with a slight overcharge, but that brings additional stress and possible ruptures, so you can't base it on vent temp. Some with a problem in the high side will not cool well with a full charge, and the high side pressure keeps building while the compressor runs, until it reaches dangerous levels. I had an old Dodge that did that, and the high side would go so high the belt would start slipping because the compressor was under so much load. It had a blockage.

I don't think you have any issues like that, it sounds like it is working fine, just leaking. How fast and from where is the question. Now that you know how to do it, even if you had to shoot it once a week or something, it'd be worth the cost of a can or 134 every week to me to have air. Then you can get it fixed in the winter, when A/C shops are looking for work and will do repairs a little cheaper.

I have a question about the symptoms. AC in my accord just went out, I have a 1997 accord SE. A couple days before my ac would smell like crap when I would first get in the car and then it would go away. Then a couple days later I turned off the car and heard a noise coming from under the glove box. This noise is still there, but the noise only happens when I turn on my ac, after I turn off the ac the noise is there for maybe 30 seconds or so then it goes away unless I turn my ac back on then it comes back. My ac blew cold for a little while but got worse to where now it no longer blows cold. Does this sound like the same problem or does anyone else have any suggestions?

it certainly sounds similar as far as the location and the sound. of course, the sound you are hearing i think is the evaporator doing something. the smell is the evaporator getting moldy, which happens if it is not working correctly.

i wish i knew more about it but suffice to say i would try to recharge it and see if it simply is low or not. i do have that sound now constantly, and i didn't before. thinking its the evaporator going bad, but hey if $20 for a can of r134a every 6 months will work until the car is sold, who cares?

it certainly sounds similar as far as the location and the sound. of course, the sound you are hearing i think is the evaporator doing something. the smell is the evaporator getting moldy, which happens if it is not working correctly.

i wish i knew more about it but suffice to say i would try to recharge it and see if it simply is low or not. i do have that sound now constantly, and i didn't before. thinking its the evaporator going bad, but hey if $20 for a can of r134a every 6 months will work until the car is sold, who cares?

$20?? Where are you buying it? I pay like $5-$6 for it.

Is yours still working good?

Please tell me that was for the kit with the suicide hose and a can of r134a.

I wonder if you guys system has a little air in it, and you're hearing the expansion valve equalizing after shut-off.

i hear it when the a/c is on, it girgles on and off every 30 seconds or so. $20 for the whole setup, yeah...

i hear it when the a/c is on, it girgles on and off every 30 seconds or so. $20 for the whole setup, yeah...

Did you say that came with a gauge on it? That's cool. Where'd you get it?

I've got about a dozen suicide hoses in my box, when they stopped selling Freon I did a lot of conversions, and each kit came with a hose. I had a professional gauge set and hoses, so I never used them, just threw 'em in the box.

But I don't have the gauge set anymore. Don't work in a shop anymore. But it'd be nice to have at least a lowside gauge.

Oh yeah, I meant to ask, does the sound coincide with the compressor cycling in and out? If so, you could probably stuff some more charge in it. That might stop the noise, if that's why it's doing it.

Hi Guys:

I've been following this thread since I've been troubleshooting a similar problem in my 92 Accord LX. Unlike Funky, I don't really know when it stopped putting out cool air so I don't know if there was a funny smell. So far, the fans and compressor are working properly, as is the heater valve. The pressure in on the low side with the system operating is around 30-35 psi. The low side line does not get cold after any length of time and there is no water in the car. The low side pressure rises to around 200 psi with the system off, but I assume that's normal as the pressure equalizes throughout the system. Any further suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Best Regards,
Oscar Deuce

I wish my AC would hold a charge for 6 months, My system will go empty in 6 hours. Maybe not EXACTLY 6 hours but I did fill it up before I went out friday night and sat when I went to work no more cold air. I don't think the smell is the "Mold" I think the smell is the R134a, Because when I bought a can of it the can started spewing while I was checking out and I grabbed another one and one of the guys set there and held the can and watched it spew and it smelled exactly like the smell I was refering to. I think it is my Evap, I found a place online to buy a new evap core for $117 is there anything else I need? Also does anyone know where I can find info on replacing it for free? I"m curious what all I will have to take apart to get to it and what all is involved. I would assume that the Evap is the only thing under the dash that would be leaking? I mean the lines could and such but a line to just start leaking on it's own I would find unusual correct? Well if anyone has a good site or a place I can download a dealer manuel that would be great.

Figured out where my leak is, thought I would post it maybe it will help someone else out. I have a cold air intake on my car and it comes off the throttle body and runs over by the battery. Well it also happens to cross your AC lines. My intake has been on there for almost a year and sitting on the ac lines. I rubbed through the High level line enough to make noticable wear on it and put a small enough hole in it to leak freon. I had a guy go over my car with a sniffer and he found that with in like 2 minutes, nothing else shows a leak.

Ok, an update for you...

Now a little over a month later (1 month 10 days since my last refill) the pressure stayed at 30 p.s.i. ... so i think my a/c system equilized there. looks like whatever was leaking must have been very slow, because i have discerned no clear leak in the last month and a half. hopefully the sealer in the can helped seal up whatever minor leak there was. i will post in another few months if there is anything to report.