In the new edition of the Dupont Registry there is a 94 Mclaren for sale. Its the first car in the exotic section. I just thought you guys would like to know.
Oh yeah, Shaq's cadillac escalade is for sale to. Its one sweet truck. There's also a pagani Zonda somewhere for sale in there.

i've been looking for one to buy!!!

thanks jay!

:silly2: joy! i gotta get that issue

Its a sweet ride. It says its a one owner car. I think that i am in love. Is is normal to fall in love with a car? Who cares!!!!

Originally posted by 2cooljay
Oh yeah, Shaq's cadillac escalade is for sale to. Its one sweet truck. its a denali

I looked at that issue when I was in Barnes and Noble. When I saw the McLaren F1 I sighed and said "One day we will be together.":D :D I think I need help.

Gentlemen, I must admit this will sadden you all, but the McLaren listed in the DuPont is SOLD. It was sold just Tuesday. I have been negotiating for that very car for the past week or more for my client, but it has sold to someone here in the states before my client was prepared to proceed. It is a remarkable car. I have seen the car in person a little more than a year ago in Europe with its previous original owner for a different client that found the colors were not agreeable to his liking. However, it is sold and destined for the East Coast of the U.S.

Do not be disappointed, however, there are other cars out there for sale. Currently there are 4 other cars that are available.

Originally posted by JE123
I looked at that issue when I was in Barnes and Noble. When I saw the McLaren F1 I sighed and said "One day we will be together.":D :D I think I need help.


i do that too, so i hope its not bad.

I think everybody thinks that way when they look at an F1. :o :p ;) :cool: :D :)

i know i do!!!!

I have been following this thread for a while. While the McLaren F1 has amazing performance numbers, I wonder how keen everyone would be to own it after trying to live with it for a week or so.

Getting in and out of the central driver's seat is a chore.

Servicing is impossibly expensive. Needlessly so. It's a BMW v12 that any decent mechanic should be able to work on. But McLaren won't release the diagnostic software. Hooray for them, but I managed to snag a copy. The thieves should be including a laptop or handheld computer too, at the prices they charge.

It's easy to drive at sane speeds, but overtaking is difficult. You can't look around the car ahead of you from either side unless you swing the car out and cross the lane marking...dangerous to say the least. With a left or right hooker, this is not a problem on one side at least. But what's the point of spending a million bucks to drive at sane speeds. So let's talk about driving it like it's supposed to be driven.

It's easy to drive at insane speeds...if you are willing to risk your license and your life. And if you are confident about the car's limits. Remember, it still obeys the laws of physics. And at the speeds a McLaren F1 lets go--I want to be your insurance beneficiary if you aspire to such stupidity.

If you take it to a track, it's good fun, but it's a limited, controlled environment, and I get sick of going around in variations of a circle after some time. You want the world to be your playground, don't you. I know I do.

If I had an amazing car, I would want to scream across Australia, north coast of Africa, South African coastline, European countrysides, most of America and Canada, and a few places in South America too. And take in a bunch of mountain passes on most continents. As long as this was the majority of driving, then, yes, a track day or two at some famous tracks would also be very welcome. Especially with an experienced instructor.

Most people who have McLarens have the means to keep it on a yacht or charter a plane and take it to these places. Why don't they? Why do they stick with Mercedes and Ferrari? Because that actually works. Whereas with a McLaren, your life ends up revolving around the car instead of it enhancing your lifestyle. Even when it's in your garage and you are abroad, there's endless phone calls and faxes to the factory, who seem to expect you to be impressed with the fact that you are dealing with McLaren.

You also expect a high level of fit and finish in a McLaren--this is not there for the most part, but at least it's acceptable. The airconditioning system, however, just plain sucks. And the styling is nice from the rear, but honestly, the front is a bit duck-billed platypus-like. And those huge headlights are outdated and heavy. As are the tyre profiles. The brakes are also outdated, although they are very good until they fade. I hear they have finally come up with a carbon composite unit, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's the Porsche turbo or Ferrari F50 brembos. Hardly something you can say McLaren should get accolades for.

The shifter is just decent. And I don't generally care for electronic shifters, but a fantastic unit should be standard in a car of this calibre.

It was innovative for its time and thereby noteworthy, but it's easily something to be admired from a distance. You can admire the Golden Gate bridge without wanting to own it. Why not the same with the McLaren F1? You can get 90% of the same sensations with any used USD100,000 supercar. That's not out of reach for most people who have been working in a decent job for sometime and are willing to make some sacrifices.

There's people out there who buy Formula 1 cars and display them in carpeted garages. I would have thought that people who aspire to one day own one of these cars would be similar. I think most of you are very impressed with the fact that it costs over USD1 million. That may be impressive in itself, but you don't buy a car for its price tag. Rather, the price tag should be indicative of the value and service received. In McLaren's case, the price tag is simply the result of them making too few cars and trying to recover their costs through them.

If McLaren had made 10,000 of these cars, and sold them for USD200,000 each, and they were commanding over USD500,000 today, then yes, it would be testimony to the car's superiority. Right now, it's just a very limited supply that is causing the high prices that these cars command. Especially in the US, where there's further obstacles to getting them into the country and driving them legally (two separate issues). But people with the resources to buy a McLaren have the means to pull strings and bring them in easily and get them on the road somehow (legally). Some of these methods are: diplomatic passport, dealer or manufacturer plates, show and display exemption, racing carnet, temporary import renewed annually, traveling museum display, etc., etc. If they are willing to do illegal stuff, they just have to fly it into a private airfield in Mexico, Canada, or the USA, and change the VIN to some car such as an Ultima or kit car that is legally registered. The only risk would be insufficient insurance, which I am sure their deep pockets would not care about. I have even heard of tricks around that!

To answer everyone's first question, yes, I had access to one for a couple of months. I thrashed the hell out of it with the owner's permission, both on the track, and on roads all over the middle East. It was hot. And pointless. The only person who was happy was the owner, who thought he was becoming a good driver by being my passenger, and the guy who sold us a new set of tyres every week.

Finally, rich Arabs are the most reckless drivers I have ever seen. I have incredible street-racing memories of Lamborghinis versus superbikes, F40s in protracted powerslides, etc. But when things went wrong, they went horribly wrong. I personally saw 5 fatalities and 2 cases of permanent paralysis in my 2 months in Dubai. And I read about hundreds more fatal accidents. Such carnage makes you realize the sheer folly of being overly seduced by magazine tests and fancy articles that present these exotic cars in romantic stories. They either ignore or gloss over the dangers of propelling a human body to 200 mph and beyond.

Thanks for reading.

Thanks for reading.

no problem.

after reading your post, i have changed my mind about owning an F1. i don't want to own one.... i'd prefer 2!!! :D :D :D :) :) :) i don't think anyone or anything can change the fact that this is my all time favorite car. i'd still do almost anything to see/drive/own one.

hey, that gave me an idea... XOTech: do you need a little intern to sharpen pencils or do other various annoying jobs for you?

you read all that??? i stopped after the third paragraph :bloated:
i'd also enjoy an internship :D

Originally posted by csa
Thanks for reading.

Nice post. I don't think that I would want to own a McLaren F1, unless everything was free. Because that is a lot of money unless you have and endless bank account. I would love to drive one though.:D

I must say that csa has captured the thoughts of many current and previous McLaren owners. The costs of the car are quite astounding, no question. The ability to deal with the car on a daily basis is nearly impossible and more likely not wise. The McLaren offers an owner undeniable claim to owning the fastest production car made (currently) and an exclusivity that is unmatched in the class of exotic car ownership. However, it really isn't meant to replace the car used to drive to work everyday.

I am sure most of you have heard the stories of a German businessman that purchased a McLaren and drove it to work daily for some time, perhaps still today. His service visit revealed repeated stretches of more than 200mph on a nearly daily basis as well. That is a man that has come to terms with using the car for a precise and rewarding use. Few others have that liberty or ability to pilot the McLaren in such manner. Most owners never do or really even want to. The respect for the McLaren is such that abuse is not really an issue. As csa has pointed out, if one wants to enjoy the g's of a well sorted out car on a track, there are better cars for such abuse that can handle it without damaging the car and at far cheaper prices.

All that known, that usually doesn't affect enthusiasts from pursuing ownership, myself included. The fact of the matter may be that once exposed to the experience, it may be short lived or put up with as part of the McLaren reality.

All this aside, reality with nearly any exotic requires a special set of rules different from any other car in terms of treatment, driving tactics, and service and expenses expectations.

As for the internship, I thank you for the offer. I am sure I could find some pencils that need sharpening. :D Truth be known, the only glamour in the exotic car industry is in the shows. The rest is a lot of research and phone calls, homework. The shows are the culmination of each owner after having spent his money on his dream car amongst so many other similar cars and owners. If any of you have never attended the Concorso Italiano in California each year, that is a trip like no other and most certainly worth the time.

Agree with everything you say, XOTech, except for the culmination of an owner's experience being to show a car. All the owners I know (about a dozen) have no interest in showing their car(s)--they want to drive them and enjoy them.

I have a couple of semi-exotics (not F1's) and I drive them almost every day when I am not traveling. You cannot imagine how annoying the questions get after you have answered them for the 200th time. I have taken to pretending to be on the mobile phone when I approach or leave just so people don't bother me with their inane questions and comments.

Showing your car is for ponces. Just like caging and domesticating a lion, it is "unnatural" for a car to be shown or put on a pedestal and worshipped. It is only appropriate for some racecars or prototypes with deserving histories, in my humble opinion. Otherwise a car is a machine. It should be enjoyed in its element, by extracting its performance potential and gaining a true understanding and mastery of its capabilities.

A better "sharing" of this car would be on a track day or a club drive. If it's just going to sit there in the middle of wine and cheese gatherings with people taking mindless photographs, you might as well have a fibreglass replica. Besides, if you want to see the real McCoy, you can always go to the McLaren showroom on Park Lane in London. There's a silver road car on display there. For the true enthusiasts, I recommend going to the Goodwood Festival of Speed in England.

csa, after rereading my previous post, I believe I wasn't as clear as I should have been. Owning an exotic car (not a superexotic like the McLaren) is very impressive early on. Most owners that I have encountered, myself included, had such enthusiasm for the car, that they made the next step to enter the car in a show or two, in the case of Ferrari and Lamborghini, even Porsche, Viper, etc. This enthusiasm to show the car usually fades rather quickly as the owner comes to terms with owning the car on a more personal basis. I find that many owners change their thoughts from displaying the car to enjoying the car on a more personal level. As you have pointed out, that means that the car should be driven, not abusively, but to the point of capability of both the car and the driver, such that the driver is able to grow to understand both a little more. Club events are a perfect environment for that.

This same addage holds true for the McLaren with the exception of public display. My impression is that McLarens typically are driven far less than a normal exotic car. European McLaren owners use their cars far more than US owners. Also McLaren owners are typically not frequents to any show. I have only heard of a couple cars being displayed at shows. There are so few cars and the owners usually are public figures of film or music or wealthy business men and women. Both prefer to be unsung with respect to their collections for the most part.

I have not had the priveledge of attending the Goodwood Festival of Speed, but read about it every year. It is most certainly an event I shall someday attend, time permitting. Neither have I had the chance to stop and see the car there in display in London and visit the factory. My travels are usually centered in greater Europe and time always seems to run short.

Mr. Chambers used to have his car displayed in one of his dealerships in the Boston area. I am not certain if the car remains there on display. I have spoke with him several times.

I did a little research into the nearly 15 McLarens I have had direct contact with in the last several months for various clients and current owners to determine the average mileage each car has travelled. Just looking at the numbers, it appears that around 60% have 15,000 to 24,000kms. An additional 30% have 5000-14,000kms and the remaining 10% having less than 5000km. Of course, all of these cars with the exception of the 7 original Amerispec converted cars, were the product of use while in their country of origin, most in Europe. Since coming to the states, and counting the 7 Amerispec cars, most of the US cars have travelled less than 3000kms. Some of those cars have been in the states only a short time as a result of the Show & Display law only recently being approved. And there are a couple exceptions. The gentleman in Texas drives his car quite regularly as do two other owners I know.

Suffice to say, as time goes on, I am sure the cars here in the US will be driven more. Another point not to be overlooked is the fact that the environment here in the states is quite different than in Europe, for example. Here, there are fewer places to stretch the car to any serious level, and none legal publicly. There is also the issue of security of the car if ever left alone. The risk is quite high if damage were ever to befall on the car for any reason of negligence or deliberately. I have had 3 semi exotic cars keyed at a tremendous cost and loss of value to the car. I shudder to think that anyone would even consider keying a McLaren, but it is possible.

:eek: Wow, these last few posts were probably the most informative and interesting posts to any Mclaren fan ever. I am impressed.

This is quite amazing, I've never been closer to any to people who have had this much contact with such knowledge and experience with the F1, it's quite a nice feeling, to see both your opinions.

Thanks

I have a question please. So if a Mc Laren F1 is bought by someone who wishes to use it on a regular basis, eg daily or say at least 3 times a week. Even if not going over 100KM/H, probably alot less on most days.
And would it be different in the case of a Mc Laren F1/F1 LM/F1 GTR street licenced.

Is it not adivceable to do so, if so why not?

Amir, A person wanting to purchase a McLaren an import it here to the US may do so under what is called the Show & Display exemption. I have posted considerable information regarding this subject in previous posts throughout the McLaren thread. I would recommend that you read through that. As for daily use, that is somewhat possible. The Show & Display provision for a McLaren owner allows for 2500miles per year use. The DOT threatens heavily that there are consequences for use over that amount of mileage and a log book is supposed to be kept of all use.

All things considered, 2500 miles per year is still quite a lot, as I feel it is somewhat unpractical to use the car heavily enough to merit further use. I do know owners that put much higher mileage on their cars, but their use of the car moves in cycles. There will be periods where the car is used considerably and other times that the car will not be used as frequently. All in all the miles balance out quite predictably.

Currently, only the McLaren roadcars are eligible for entry and use in the US under Show & Display. The LMs and GTRs may come here to the US only under a temporary VISA (racing or show VISA).

I am currently in negotiations to bring in a third McLaren to the states adding to the near 16 cars that are already here. The process is somewhat involved and time consuming, but straight forward.

Thank you sir for your reply.

So the near 16 Mc Larens here are all F1 road cars. What colors do the Mc Laren F1s come in if it is not an ignorant question to ask. And also what year of production are the Mc Larens that reside in the US.

If I may also ask, what is the price range for these in the US please, and for what years? EG a '95 costs around $$$$$$ and a '98 costs around $$$$$$$. And how much are they in Euros (in Europe) before they are brought to the US or anywhere else please?

If I need any more information I will be posting later on, I hope that does not annoy you.

Thank you.

Amir,

With regard to the colors of McLaren F1s, the original cars were painted in two ways; to the exact specifications of a particular owner, or as you have probably noticed, most cars were painted silver, that were not otherwise specified by the original owner. After the cars is sold from the original owner, the new owner sometimes chooses to repaint the car, possibly to restore the finish to like-new condition or simply to give the car a new personal flavor unique to the new owner. My observations are that about 20% repaint their cars upon ownership transition and about half of those owners change the color.

Currently, the cars that are here in the US are limited to 1994 and 1995. The reason being the complexity of passing the emissions testing of the later cars has currently not been overcome to allow 1996, 97, and 98 cars into the states. Rest assured, this will happen eventually.

Present values of the cars are quite consistant regardless of the year of production. A car that has already been converted for use here in the US is worth about $1.4-1.5Million. A European car, or any other location for that matter, is worth about $1.3-1.4Million. The conversion and importation costs are around $100,000.

An important thing to remember with the McLarens is that these prices I have listed are assuming the car is in exceptional condition, which I have found most are not at all. Around 75% of the cars I have seen are in a simply shameful condition. The above values drop of very quickly if regular service has not been accomplished, the fuel cells have not been replaced as scheduled, if the mileage and use of the car are excessive, paint condition, color combination, and many other factors also play into the car's value.

I have seen some fairly affordable McLarens in terms of initial investment, but they require considerable further investment to get the car back to its proper maintenance condition.

If you would like me to further assess a car's value for the purpose of purchase or sale, I can do that. You are welcome to PM me with further details.

What changes were made to the 96-98 cars that they didn't pass emissions, and can that be changed in order to get them here?
Also you said that if the paint condition is bad then the value declines, would the addition of a Clear Bra reduce the value of the car?

you ppl write too much...

Originally posted by snowboarder
What changes were made to the 96-98 cars that they didn't pass emissions, and can that be changed in order to get them here?
Also you said that if the paint condition is bad then the value declines, would the addition of a Clear Bra reduce the value of the car?


in '96 the OBDII requirements came about. i'm guessing that the F1 didn't pass emissions.


Originally posted by ZondaFreak02
you ppl write too much...

what?

you wrote like 20 page essays ...nevermind

i like those 20 page essays. learn more stuff about stuff.

you know you don't have to read them if you dont want to??

ok calm down i was only kidding

phew....


i thought i was going to have to lay down the law:sun:

I haven't been back to this forums for a while and wow so much information already. The reason I sign up in dah first place was cos of McLaren Forums hehehehe so

Yep if money was not a problem McLaren is a must ( if I was Bill Gates hahah )


McLaren > ALL TIME FAV cars, Lambo > second heheheh !

It soulds like it is torture just to get the McLarens in the states, not to mention the newer ones! How on earth am I suppose to get my McLaren F1 LM in the states? No, don't really own one, wish I did though, huh....maybe in a year or two. Think, I'll be 18 driving a McLaren F1 LM! Burst my bubble and I'll burst yours, lol.

So is it possible to get an LM in states and actually drive it. So if you had enough money, why can't the McLaren factory just make one for you, they do release a few now and then. About the essays, talk about teaching me a lot of things. Thanks you guys, I really appreciate the time you spent. But, why are there so many restrictions, I mean I know about the speed, but what is up with that, I think it is your car, you should be able to drive it if you are being legal!

Ok, ok, I understand all about the big expensive, fast car going to get people killed, but why can't you go up to a window, say, 'I'm responsible with the fastest care known to man (not literally), and I want my lisense to register it. Ok, life is not that simple, but I sure wish it could be.

I am hearing a lot of I wants when it comes to the McLarens, but why is it so impossible to get your hands on one? I mean, I think it is rather stupid that they closed the factory just to raise the value. And about this sulten (or how ever you spell it) guy, WHO IS HE? Is this kind of like the movie Three Kings and all those cars?

You know what, being my first post I feel I have relieved myself of my stresses, or is that the coffee starting to calm down a bit. I have had no sleep for a day and am so edgy I feel like I can hear everything. I whant to know what it is like to even sit in one of these goddesses! Huh, some day very very soon.

One of my last question, what kind of security systems would you use for a car like this. I mean, someone can't just walk up, get in it, start it and go with out you being able to find it, or keeping that from happening all together. I thought there was an extremely expensive device that was pressure sensitive around certain areas, or maybe not.

Noooo! My McLaren F1 sliped out of my hands. Been talking to a dealer from quite some time now. Works for Motorcars International and they had a McLaren F1 chassis number 072 which was built in May/1998 and was one of the last cars built! Purchased the car near Essen, Germeny, now with new owner in San Francisco for 1.5 Million USD!

Also Last year he, as in Steve Will, delivered another car (titanium metallic grey/chassis #045) to an investment banker that also resides in the bay area. Oh how I let my beauty go so fast, but he is going to post me as soon as a R-E-A-L car becomes availible! Guess that was my dream gone for a while.

Meric,

You have been doing your homework. I respect that. If indeed you are serious about a McLaren and have the funds to follow through, there is no question that a car can be purchased. As far as a McLaren LM in the states. There is quite a level of complication with the LM and the US regulations. As you have possibly gathered from my previous posts here on the McLaren Forum, the McLaren qualifies for the Show & Display Law. There are still heavy restrictions for such cars, but at least they are allowed in the country. As far as all the regulations and restrictions, well, it can simply be boiled down to one thing, Money. The DOT/EPA want every penny they can get and the charges the levy are not pennys. It it expensive because they can get away with it as a luxury. The people that really want the car will pay.

As you have read, the 94-95 McLaren is no problem to convert (about $150,000-200,000 to convert). The 96-98 cars are quite a bit more complicated. I think I described that in detail somewhere in this forum. The cost is easily another $100,000. The point is that it can be done. The GTRs cannot come into this country under Show & Display. They can come here under alternative means, such as a Museum Visa or a Racing Visa. Both are temporary, only 1 year. There are also other methods that are less than ideal or the most legal.

Unfortunately, the LM has the same motor as the GTRs and is well known by the EPA. They know which cars are which and what is elgible to pass the "smog" test. It is possible, but more than likely very difficult to get an LM to pass. If the car would pass, there is a possibility that EPA would let the car into the states.

I am 110% sure that McLaren will never build another McLaren. They do perform repair and mod work, but no further production will ever be done. Their ability at extensive repair is impressive with major sections of bodywork remade from the original carbon fiber patterns, but that is still technically not a new production car.

With regard to the purchase of a car, you will quickly find that McLaren Cars will indeed offer their services of locating a car for you, but I have found that their premium is quite high to do so. It is my opinion to leave McLaren to do what they do best, service and maintain the best car on the planet. It would be my recommendation to leave the sales to those that are more aggressive on price for the sake of the buyer and definitely someone who is very knowledgable of McLarens and the typical service issues and what to look for when finding, inspecting, purchasing, shipping, and converting such a car.

I currently do have REAL cars available.

XOTech,

Thanks for replying to my post, and I am glad to hear that it is possible to get a McLaren LM into states. That sure is a lot of money for those people's kids to go to school. So basically, if you are willing to pay almost any amount of money to get a hold of that LM, it is most possible. I mean, if you had the money to buy the car, why would you not be able to pay the rest.

If someone ever was able to get their hands on an LM model, being there are only 5, how much do you think that would run, just to get it? I mean, if there are only 5 in the world, if I am correct on that, then how the heck do you get the person to let go of the car? Not like they are just going to give it up, are they? Huh, I guess I will just have to find someone and start running numbers by their heads.

So, since almost everything is possbile with money, how much do you think it would cost to get one in states? Not exactly, but like are we looking at 300 K or less, or more? Must be hard to say since very few people have one.

So you do have REAL cars for sale, lol, that is good. Where do you work, exactly if you don't mind me asking. DO you have a site to go to, to check out the inventory? Huh...how I would like to be in a photo with a McLaren. I mean this really is sad, I am obsessed with the McLaren F1 LM, guess I'm not alone!

As of me doing homework, I have spent many years, not as many as most, researching these cars. Came across this one forum that said this guy put a NOS system into his McLaren, and here was my mental reply. First off I doubt you had the cash to get the car. Second, a Nitros Ox. System would totally mess up the car, doesn't it take about 10,000 miles on the miles for every use, not to mention the damage to the car. :(

Well I have been up all night again, so I am actually going to sleeeeeep! LaterZ EveryOne! :apoke:

Oh, I think I forgot to ask, but who is this Sultan guy and his brother with the McLarens....and I hope he doesn't own any Lm's!
:eek:

I'm pretty sure he has one. I remember reading that he has at least a few regualr F1's, and either XOtech or another source said that he had an LM. I also remember hearing that his brother had an LM limo, but again, try XOtech, he knows more about these cars than Mclaren themselves.

Are you like really serious for importing an LM though? I'm not doubting you, there's an abundance of exotic owners on here, so now people get credibility a lot easier.

I can see you're expressing some concern with the fact that there are only 5, I would too :)

PS: XOtech, do you know a lot about the 1962 Ferrari 250 GTO? I saw one recently (for sure, it was parked at a Ferrari Festival) and I was wondering what the history was on it.

Meric,

As you would imagine, the fees for importation go to more than just one facility or business. It seems that everyone gets a piece of the pie, but the fees are not necessarily unique to the high end cars. There are duty taxes, import taxes, shipping charges, storage costs, paperwork fees, and of course, conversion costs. All of those things tend to add up rather quickly. Let it also be said, that while the effort of pioneering the conversion of the LM may be expensive, throwing money at all that work on the car will not make it happen any faster or any better. The conversion process is one that takes a tremendous amount of time and attention to detail to be sure that everyone is doing what needs to be done and at the right time.

But also keep in mind, while it may be possible to import a McLaren LM, it will not be easy. Not to mention that the first car will undergo all the struggles of being the first one. In my mind, I still believe it to be possible. McLaren Cars, Ltd, are not interested in working with or contributing in any fashion to the conversion of a 96 and newer roadcar or the GTRs and LMs for US use. All best efforts have returned rejected from McLaren Cars.

In my time watching and selling cars, there has only been one LM sold. It will more than likely be one of the only LMs to change hands. The LMs were purchased by people that will likely never have the need or desire to part with their car. However, that said, there will undoubtedly still be cars that can be bought for the right money. Even if the right price could purchase the car, the public will never see the car for sale. I am well aware of the many McLaren owners out there and what cars they have. I am aware of an LM that very possibly could be purchased for the right price.

The market for the LM is definitely higher than a normal roadcar. Current discussions suggest that a number close to $3M would generate valid interest on the part of the owner. The fact that there are only 5 LMs ever built should be of great relief to an LM buyer. If indeed a buyer is willing to go the distance to buy an LM, there is reasonable expectation that few others will ever even be offered such an opportunity. Such a buyer will be of only 4 other people on the planet that has the priveledge of owning a McLaren LM.

As for the Sulton of Brunia, last I was able to confirm, he owned several McLaren roadcars and one LM. As for the McLaren limo, there was a company in South Africa (if I remember correctly) that designed and built a McLaren kitcar. Now this is no ordinary kit car, but nonetheless, not the real thing. The accuracy of the car was quite impressive. There were something like 13 cars built but never sold. They were "given" to friends and relatives so as not to infringe on the McLaren Cars, Ltd. rights and patents, etc. One of those kitcars was reported as being converted into a limo. I have not seen pictures and cannot confirm this for certain, but the rumor was out there.

Porsche,

I am quite familiar with the Ferrari 250 GTO. If you can provide me with the chassis number, I can most certainly be able to give you some highlights of the car's history and racing career. If you don't have the chassis number, if you tell me what show you saw the car at, I would more than likely still be able to identify the car. I have probably seen the car. Let me know if I can help.

I do not currently have a website. I do have a site that is designed in preliminary stages, but is not finished. I also do not post an inventory of what I am currently offering. The reason being is that the amount of effort it takes to assemble such a list is quite high and by the time it is finished and promoted, nearly every car on the list is either sold or not for sale. Also with the type of cars that I tend to specialize in such as the McLaren, owners do not care to have their car promoted publicly. I work much more efficiently with direct contact with buyers and sellers.

As or NOS on a McLaren, that is like putting a rocket motor on a VW Bug. Why!?... :) It is absurd to even suggest it. There are a great many of modifications that can be done to a McLaren within reason of its reliability and while maintaining its integrity (in terms of value) that would put the car well into the books of performance without such feable, cheat devices like NOS or a supercharger. Natural Aspiration is where it's at.

Just my 2cents.

Wow, sounds like a lot to go through just to get one. I was wondering about what you said about how the factory was not interested in us conversions of the newer models. I was wondering if you could explain this a bit, please. I mean, you go out there and spend over $3-4 million one one of their rarest vehicles and they won't even convert it over to be driven in the US! What is up with that, maybe I should go for another McLaren model just so that I can get the factory to be ab;e to comvert it.

Can anyone tell me what kind of security the McLaren's have or of what the most owners of them put in?

Thanks for your answers XOTech! :flash:

WOW that is alot of information.
And i was wondering i don't know if u posted this already but wut do they do when the Convert it to US?
Thanks
-ryan

Meric,

McLaren has made it quite clear that they are not in the conversion business. Originally when they were designing the McLaren, they studied the regulations and requirements for every country, most importantly the US regulations because they were the most stringent. They were the toughest to meet. As they got deeper into the requirements, it became apparent that to meet the US requirements was more costly than they were willing to commit to and chose not to proceed with the US certification. Now thanks to the thoughts and efforts of several key people in the DOT, and car owners that wished to bring their cars to the states, the advent of the Show & Display Law at least makes the import of the McLaren possible.

McLaren Cars, Ltd, has remained true to their original decision, not to pursue any aspect of US conversion or EPA compliance. Since all of the original McLarens have been sold, there are no new cars and the money from sales rarely ever goes through the factory, unless a buyer contracts McLaren Cars directly. They do, however, still religiously maintain the cars in terms of service as do several Service Centers located in various countries.

Not only will McLaren Cars not pursue any conversion efforts, they will also not support any such effort. All conversion research and retrofit is solely the responsibility of other parties, not McLaren.

There is one exception. As a result of the 1994 and 95 EPA regulations for smog here in the states (pre OBD ii), McLaren will (at a customer's request) convert a '94 or '95 McLaren for use in the US. They will not do any such conversion for a 96 and newer McLaren (post OBD ii).

Regarding security, most owners don't install any system at all. They do not come with a security system when new, but it can be installed. I have seen customer cars that have had systems installed that are quite impressive. It is entirely up to the owner. Anything can be done. It is only money. :)

Denali Man. I know there is a lot of information here, as for the requirements of conversion, I have posted numerous posts regarding this subject. I would recommend a search on all of my previous posts or just snoop around in the McLaren forum. I am quite outspoken in this forum as you will find. If there is still a quesion that isn't answered, let me know, I will be glad to answer it.

I have just read all the baove text... It took 1 1/2 hours... and I learnt so much! its like the end of a novel!

Originally posted by XOTech
Porsche,

I am quite familiar with the Ferrari 250 GTO. If you can provide me with the chassis number, I can most certainly be able to give you some highlights of the car's history and racing career. If you don't have the chassis number, if you tell me what show you saw the car at, I would more than likely still be able to identify the car. I have probably seen the car. Let me know if I can help.




XOTECH, the car was located at a Pavilion at Mont Tremblant, Quebec, Canada. I tried my best to find info but there was none, at the time I was there (July 29th) It had a black "74" race number (sticker on hood & doors), the car had blue seats, although I believe they were stock and no other markings whatsoever other than the Yellow Ferrari badge on the hood. I have pictures, but not with me.

Porsche.

I have done some searching but haven't turned up anything positive. I do know of a couple cars in the NY area that quite possibly could have made the trip to the Canada meet. The number may or may not be of use as they are changed from time to time depending if the car is actually raced on the vintage circuit or not.. I will see what I can find.. Please post a picture when you get the chance. There are slight differences in each car that can sometimes lead to a closer match.

XOTECH, the car was located at a Pavilion at Mont Tremblant, Quebec, Canada. I tried my best to find info but there was none, at the time I was there (July 29th) It had a black "74" race number (sticker on hood & doors), the car had blue seats, although I believe they were stock and no other markings whatsoever other than the Yellow Ferrari badge on the hood. I have pictures, but not with me.

My apologies for resurrecting an ancient thread, but I saw this photo today and I recalled someone here inquiring about a 250 GTO with blue seats. This appears to be the one:

http://ferrarihistory3.homestead.com/files/250GTO_3987GT.jpg

Per this website (http://www.ferrarihistory.homestead.com/collections.html) the car belongs to Ralph Lauren (click his name) which would certainly explain it being seen at Mont Tremblant. The site lists the production number of this GTO as #3987GT. There are several other photos of this car at that site. :cool:

>8^)
ER

Steve Will went to Germany to buy 072 having already arranged the sale with the owner, Gunther Dahms. Dahms reneged, but three weeks later the sale was completed. Will and Newport Autosport were 50/50 on 045, ex Petrik which is now Elon Musk's I beleive.
Fritz handled the "conversions".
Pre-1/1996 McLarens are a slam dunk with passing US emissions.
The LM does not meet US specs. And if it were modified to do so, it would run like crap. The LM was designed for a non-catalyist exhaust system. How did LM03 get in?
I had an F50 owner out west tell me that $110,000.00 will guarantee "conversion" and "approval". He has done it plenty of times.

gerd, where do you get your info???

Peloton,

Regretably, I am almost 100% sure it is not Ralph Lauren's. I dug up some old photos of two from my 2003 trip out, maybe someone can identify them.

http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/watermark.php?file=/503/305250GTO.jpg

http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/watermark.php?file=/503/305250GTOr.jpg

http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/watermark.php?file=/503/305250GTO2.jpg

edit: Thanks Peloton, I was cruising in off topic and found the same info. So they should work now.
* I have all of these available in high res too.

I can see why it's not working, but can't explain why. I clicked on the "Gallery" link below your post and it took me to them. You have clearly used the link that AF.com provides for embedding the images into the forums so I don't understand why it's not working. :confused:

However, if you right click on the photo in the gallery it gives a slightly different URL in the Properties. You can compare the two here:

http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/watermark.php?file=/503/305250GTO-med.jpg
http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/watermark.php?file=503/305250GTO.jpg

There are only subtle differences in bold, but one other thing I can tell you is that the 1st link doesn't work when you cut and paste it into a new window - it just gives a page of errors. The second link does work though, and will probably work in an image tag.

Sorry I couldn't help you out on the GTO by the way. :(

>8^)
ER

Sorry I couldn't help you out on the GTO by the way. :(

Alas, I have spoken too soon. I have an extensive collection of GTO photos and just happened to have a few shots of this particular car. It appeared at the 40th Anniversary gathering of the 250 GTO in Bourgogne, France which was held September 9th-13th, 2002. The vehicle is listed as:

3705GT Red – French Tric’ Stripe - E. Davies

Excellent coverage of the event can be found here at barchetta.cc (http://www.barchetta.cc/All.Ferraris/events-stories/events/2002/250-gto-40th-anniversary-meet/250-gto-40th-anniversary-meet-story/index.html) including a gallery of photos.

There is further confirmation it is the same GTO on that site I linked to previously:

http://ferrarihistory3.homestead.com/3705gt.html

Finally, here is Barchetta.cc's history page on the car. It had quite an impressive racing career:

http://www.barchetta.cc/english/All.Ferraris/Detail/3705gt.250GTO.htm

>8^)
ER

gerd, where do you get your info???

Oh, and I can answer this rather easily as well....

He'll never tell... :grinno:

>8^)
ER

a 250 GTO with blue seats. This appears to be the one:

Per this website (http://www.ferrarihistory.homestead.com/collections.html) the car belongs to Ralph Lauren (click his name)ER

Hi,

I am 90% sure that it is Ralph Lauren's. That building is Paul Russell & Co. in Essex, MA (www.paulrussell.com). It was undergoing full restoration when I was there earlier this year. I'm going back there in a couple of weeks. It had blue seats then (a lot of cars from that era had blue seats - I forget the reason why).

EDIT: I forgot to add that Paul Russell has done a ton of work for Ralph Lauren on a number of different cars (Bugatti T57SC Atlantic Coupe to name one).

Drew

It's www.paulrussellandco.com.

It's www.paulrussellandco.com.

Either works for me. I think both end up at paulrussell.com though.

-Drew

Drew-
He wasn't saying that the car first GTO I posted with the blue seats was not Lauren's, only that the car he saw was not Lauren's.

After viewing his photos I would agree - that's why I dug up the second set of photos/info. Things should be clear now... :cool:

>8^)
ER

Drew-
He wasn't saying that the car first GTO I posted with the blue seats was not Lauren's, only that the car he saw was not Lauren's.

>8^)
ER

I thought so. I was just backing up your statement about it being Ralph Lauren's and also providing some more info about where it was earlier this year. Does that make sense? Of course, I may be mucking things up even more... :screwy: (I threw the Screwy smiley in there because I know you like to use it).

Ok cool - thanks for clearing that up. Have you seen either of Lauren's McLarens in your travels Drew? I'm assuming you would have mentioned that before if you had, but thought I would ask.

Also, I'm not sure if you caught this, but that website has this photo of Lauren's F40:

http://ferrarihistory3.homestead.com/files/F40_88706.jpg

The caption on the photo says it was taken at Paul Russell & Co. in June 2003 and you can clearly see his Bugatti Atlantic's in the background. The Atlantic is one of my most favorite classics - a truly beautiful car, no other way to describe it.

And I do like the :screwy: smiley. It makes me :lol2:

>8^)
ER

The caption on the photo says it was taken at Paul Russell & Co. in June 2003 and you can clearly see his Bugatti Atlantic's in the background
ER

When I was there they were building that room into what it is now and the Bugs were there (F40 was not) but in a separate area. Their shop is kind of maze-like. There seems to be all sorts of additions and wings branching off from the two main shop/paint areas.

The McLarens were not there. I think RL and his personal mechanic bring them to NJ or back to McLaren IF they need anything. I think it's interesting to note that quite a few of his other cars are at shops while the McLarens stay close by - he's got his priorities straight.

I just found another story the other day about one of his F1s being spotted on RT123 in South Salem, NY. Unfortunately there were no photos to go along with the story. His F1s remain very elusive from the camera... :(

They'll turn up eventually I guess, and when they do I'm certain someone in here will find them. :iceslolan

>8^)
ER

The Atlantic is one of my most favorite classics - a truly beautiful car, no other way to describe it.




8 figures seems to do a pretty good job.