Just watched "the day after tomorrow". Thinking buying an hybrid as my next car as my effort to save mother nature :-). Any rumor about a hybrid Camry?

I saw an interesting article on hybrid vehicles. The one point I remember was concerning their resale value. No one knows what the value of these cars will be after a few years. For that matter, no one knows how much it will cost to replace the batteries in them. How much would you pay for a vehicle that has an extremely expensive battery with an unknown amount of life left in it? This bothers me.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A63611-2004May28.html

Toyota will most likely have a Hybrid available for EVERY model that they make within 4 years or so. Even the trucks. I'm a Toyota mechanic and have heard first hand that this is true.

Brian, I think within a few years, all those info will be available. Use less fuel, that certainly sounds like the right track. I just hope they will not be substantially more expensive.

I am mostly worried about resale value for cars with unknown battery-life left. Seems like the battery will last longer or shorter depending on how the car is driven. They need a way of quantifying battery life or a guarantee on that from a dealer or something. Cars are a significant investment. With diesels' mileage being as good as it is, they are a serious alternative to hybrids (simpler too).

But the emission of diesel engine is more harmful, look this

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=219708

Toyota Camry hybrid is scheduled for a 2006 release. As for the batteries, a toyota dealer told me the battery on the Prius costs around $4K to replace and has a 100K mile warranty. So basically the more miles the closer you are to the $4k replacement charge so resale will definitely be affected.

But the emission of diesel engine is more harmful, look this

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=219708

I could provide you a long list of articles that are equally pro-diesel in there analysis of emissions vs gasoline engines.

Don't forget, electric cars require fossil fuel to run also. The emissions of gasoline engines is higher in many ways than that of diesels. There efficiency is considerably less too.

The gasoline engines in hybrids are what generate the electricity for the electric motor. A pure electric car still gets a significant portion of it's electricity for charging from coal-fired generators.

The issue of diesel emissions is not so clear cut as many would have you believe. Technology can overcome all of the diesel's shortcomings once the trucking industry becomes a minor player in the politics of diesel emissions.

Brian,
Please correct me if I'm wrong but isn't it regenerative braking and not the gas engine that provides electricity in the new Prius?

Also, I think we'll see more diesel vehicles in the USA whenever we install low sulphur diesel fuel here. Then we'll have "clean diesel" as they do in Europe. :2cents:

I have drove the Pruis, sold for Toyota....
The Pruis generates power when you start slowing down... If you coast down a hill it will generate power...
Setting at a stop light, no power is being used.... I am not sure about the braking though.... The new Pruis has more get up & go than the new Camry 4 cyl...
The Highlander will go Hybird next year & have the same 6 cyl. engine for its power plant... Bob

No matter what the form or timing of the energy conversion, the gasoline engine provides the energy to recharge the battery. There is no other energy source in the vehicle, other than gasoline.

That is true. But it sounds u can reuse some energy such as from braking. U can not use it with a normal Camry.

In both vehicles, the power originates from gasoline. The electic vehicle is just more efficient for various reasons.

As far being greener about cars. How about keeping the car you own longer and fixing it.
The energy to make a new car is very high compared to the energy you may save by buying a hybrid.
Diesels will all be clean by 2006? I think once the low sulfur fuel is available to run cats and particulate traps. These are to be mandatory on trucks. To spend $4000 on a battery every 100k is crazy. And how is the production of those for the environment? If you drive highway, the added weight of most of these systems is worse than the gas engine only equivalent would be. I get 45 mpg in my Saturn highway and 33 city and its an automatic with seating for 5 not 4 or 2. In 200,000 miles you could only hope to save maybe 3 or 4 thousand in gas believing the EPA numbers, which are way overstated for most drivers of these cars. In that time you may have replace $8000 in batteries. Don't get me wrong, I believe the hybrid technology has a place, but GM is right in their approach to it by hitting big buses, and the trucks with a simple affordable hybrid. A new car never saved anyone any money. Maybe they will be good for me. I will wait till people start getting rid of them really cheap since the regen battery is dead and I will drive it without that capability and ditch the dead weight of the battery.

Do not underestimate the advance of technology. 10 years ago, 1000 can only get u a 486 PC. Look what u can get now?

And my 81 Celica still runs like a champ. That car only cost me $350 a decade ago. You would still barely need more than that 486 if you still had it.

No way, 486 is too slow for today's software. And somebody is going to need a new car, right? What i mean is that the cost of battery may drop very quickly.

Many people don't need today's software. They have just made the software slower since the faster processors are available. Word Perfect 5.1, Quattro Pro, dBase, Lotus 123 - all run fine on a 10-year old computer. And they do the job more efficiently that the multi-GB software marketed today.

That is really something new for me. But i still think cost of battery will drop.

No doubt

Why go hybrid when you can go diesel?

There are pros and cons for both technologies. I would buy a diesel, but they are not for everyone.

I also drove the Hybrid Prius. I had it for two days. I had the one with everything except side curatin airbags (Navi, bluetooth, etc.) It was fun to drive! It was extremely peppy, comfortable, and semmingly economical. There are four power sources in the vehicle, the electric motor, the battery, the regenerative brakes, and the engine. The engine is the ultimate power supply independant of the others (except gasoline). the car will automatically charge its batteries with the engine or the regen brakes. The CVT was wierd, because when you expected the car to shift to a higher gear, there wasn't one. All in all, I would definitely consider driving one of these, probably as a leased vehicle. It would eliminate the worry of what if ... in ... years. Toyota has a well proven track record on its engines and cars, but I agree with the lot of you that we need to see what this Hybrid synergy drive is made of.

What I found out was that the hybrid synergy drive is warranteed for 8 years or 100K miles. That means they will replace the battery for 8 years. The problem that I have heard is that they do not know how to replace a single cell in the battery, just the entire battery. The rewards for these vehicles are the tax break for having an alternate fuel vehicle and the gas mileage. Although it may take a couple of years to recoup the extra money spent on the car (in gas and taxes, so figure by year two or three you are on the plus side). These cars are targeted for those who drive a lot of CITY miles, not so much highway. I believe that there is a place for this type of vehicle. I also believe that its availability and acceptance will be steered by the people who own the technology or the politicians that they buy!

But what do I know?