Escalades, living room on wheels

why do people buy massive, super expensive, gas guzzling, environment killing, american status symbol crap, such as the escalade. (same goes for navigator, H2, excursion, sequioa need i go on?) These huge 'living room on wheels' are not only guzzling gas and a lot of it, but people that drive them, somehow think they are invincible. A lot of the time however, they are, and they obliterate people in small cars. :banghead: Like a friend of mine, about 6 weeks ago, driving a small mustang (85). He was killed while driving, by a massive suv. People driving SUVs are not invincible. They have a much larger chance to roll than a small car, and the handling is about as good as a freakin' log!
My main points being
- Way to expensive!
- Huge!!
- Handling is crap!
- gas guzzling
- invincible and takes out smaller vehicles easily
-if not invincible you think you are and this leads to the potential for extreme accidents.
Just because you drive a tank, also, does not give you permission to be an ass on the road.

Iman de las chicas

one last thing, are they even fun to drive? :screwy: don't you think it would be a lot more fun to drive a little WRX cruisin down a country road and flooring that baby opposed to a 26" wheeled, box shaped, 2 ton tank! sell it and buy three sports cars and race your friends :2cents:

I would agree with you but I own one, and I have always wanted one and when i got the chance to get a 2004 i bought it. I dont drive it like a tank, but i definetly see where you are coming from. I definetly didnt buy it beacuse of its "excellent" gas milage, speed, or small shape. I agree with what your saying about large SUVs-

But you say it easily takes out small vehicles? what about a Simi, or dump truck running into a SUV? I mean the same thing will happen to the escalade as the smaller cars in the same situation. I'm sorry about your friend and I dont intend to drive mine like a tank or be an ass on the roads.

why do people buy massive, super expensive, gas guzzling, environment killing, american status symbol crap, such as the escalade. (same goes for navigator, H2, excursion, sequioa need i go on?) These huge 'living room on wheels' are not only guzzling gas and a lot of it, but people that drive them, somehow think they are invincible. A lot of the time however, they are, and they obliterate people in small cars. :banghead: Like a friend of mine, about 6 weeks ago, driving a small mustang (85). He was killed while driving, by a massive suv. People driving SUVs are not invincible. They have a much larger chance to roll than a small car, and the handling is about as good as a freakin' log!
My main points being
- Way to expensive!
- Huge!!
- Handling is crap!
- gas guzzling
- invincible and takes out smaller vehicles easily
-if not invincible you think you are and this leads to the potential for extreme accidents.
Just because you drive a tank, also, does not give you permission to be an ass on the road.

Iman de las chicas

one last thing, are they even fun to drive? :screwy: don't you think it would be a lot more fun to drive a little WRX cruisin down a country road and flooring that baby opposed to a 26" wheeled, box shaped, 2 ton tank! sell it and buy three sports cars and race your friends :2cents:



:rolleyes:People buy them because there awsome.Im 6'4" and can hardly get into something as small as a WRX or Mustang.Did you ever go to think that people may buy them because there very safe?I would rather be in a Escalade then a WRX during an accident.Environtment killing...oh boy,another nature freak.Oh crap,stupid me,I almost forgot that everything besides SUV's are all electric.Your WRX or little racing machines contribute nothing to the worlds pollution right?Neither any of the worlds factorys.Point being its not just SUV's.And who cares about gas consumption.IF you can afford the truck then your can afford the gas.And did you ever notice that most people that drive them have reasons to?Like big families,travelers,people that can't stand tiny econo boxes like myself and like big vehicles.And if you don't want to be "obliterated" then dont drive something so small.Handling is crap,yea,and there meant to be driven like Corvettes too.Wow,your a bright one indeed.:eek7:And no,I would rather not drive a WRX or a small fast car.What i like abotu big SUV's is that when your driving them,your not thrown into the other lane after you run over a tar filling!Infact,you hardly feel any potholes in a Escalade!I was driving my brothers Nissan Maxima last week and every time u hit the slightest bump or tar filling,the steering wheel jerked to either the left or right.I don't like that.If I want something fast I'd get a Vette.And about SUV's rolling,if you roll your SUV,you might come out with a little less then some whip lash from your seat belt.Point being,SUV's a much safer,much more comfortable, and huge(which is a good thing).

Thank you! i fully agree with every word you just said, you said everything I was trying to say and more! Thanks

Hey thatnks man!

I'm taller than you HandodDoom and I get into most cars comfortably, I've owned many small cars, from a Prelude to a Yugo, to a Corolla and so on and I fit in them pretty damn comfortably thank you, there is absolutely no need for an SUV for the case of passenger room.

My BIGGEST problem with the Escalade is that it has absolutely no purpose, it has about as much off road ability as a CTS, has an obnoxiously high center of gravity, is prone to roll over and bleeds the earth of it's fuel, due to the fact that it's heavy and has a pointlessly large motor.

Now for the price of an Escalade, as a matter of fact cheaper, you can get a VW Touareg V10 TDI, have a hell of a lot more Torque, pull as much as a Ram and go offroading with the best of them, oh and it's diesel, so with sensible driving 25 mpg would be easily possible. Oh and it has an excellent on-road ride as well.

The Escalades survive only on the premise that
1. They are aimed at middle aged men trying to extend thier ego, because they can't extend a certain thing down low

and 2. Rappers and Wiggas who want to be bling bling y0!!! and waste thier money on crap.

Or dumb suburban bitches who have two kids, who are weedier than most kids whose parents drive Geos and want to waste precious parking room and waste everybodies time.

Dam Jim,you take these things straight to the heart.Sorry,I should have mentioned this before,Im 6'4",large not just in height,but im a big person.I weigh close to 300lbs.I don't get into small cars comfortably.What do you mean there is absolutly no purpose?People like them,they sell great,not to mention the Escalade is the most stolen vehicle in America,so people must like them a lot.And yes,thats a true fact.Some people like tiny things,others like huge things.Im sure an Escalade can handle off-roading like cake.But who takes there Escalade off-roading anyway?Not many people are going to pay almost 60K to ruin their truck.Not to mention its a LUXURY SUV.Thats almost like saying a Deville has about as much racing ability as a Chevy Caprice Classic.You don't race them simply because its a luxury car.You don't take a Escalade off-roading simply because its a luxury SUV,its wasnt built to take on the Rockies.I know you love Chryslers so I will say this,Jeeps roll A LOT more then just about any SUV maker on the planet.Escalades have Stabili-Track,that improves handling by quite a bit,and if you don't drive it like a Ferrari,then whats there to worry about.Honestly,I could care less about fuel,theres plenty to go around for along time,its gonna be awhile before we run out of fuel on this planet,and a lot of cars being built will ve electric by that time.Hmm,I never see anybody whining about the Maybach Maybachis heavy and has a pointlessly large motor?That consumes a lot of gas,and the Veyron,and so on.Things are bigger in Caddy world,get over it dude.

And just about all this is pointless to the thread.The dude up top was complaining about the size,not the offroading ability.Its safer then just about any car out there.

Dam Jim,you take these things straight to the heart.Sorry,I should have mentioned this before,Im 6'4",large not just in height,but im a big person.I weigh close to 300lbs.I don't get into small cars comfortably.What do you mean there is absolutly no purpose?People like them,they sell great,not to mention the Escalade is the most stolen vehicle in America,so people must like them a lot.And yes,thats a true fact.Some people like tiny things,others like huge things.Im sure an Escalade can handle off-roading like cake.But who takes there Escalade off-roading anyway?Not many people are going to pay almost 60K to ruin their truck.Not to mention its a LUXURY SUV.Thats almost like saying a Deville has about as much racing ability as a Chevy Caprice Classic.You don't race them simply because its a luxury car.You don't take a Escalade off-roading simply because its a luxury SUV,its wasnt built to take on the Rockies.I know you love Chryslers so I will say this,Jeeps roll A LOT more then just about any SUV maker on the planet.Escalades have Stabili-Track,that improves handling by quite a bit,and if you don't drive it like a Ferrari,then whats there to worry about.Honestly,I could care less about fuel,theres plenty to go around for along time,its gonna be awhile before we run out of fuel on this planet,and a lot of cars being built will ve electric by that time.Hmm,I never see anybody whining about the Maybach Maybachis heavy and has a pointlessly large motor?That consumes a lot of gas,and the Veyron,and so on.Things are bigger in Caddy world,get over it dude.

And just about all this is pointless to the thread.The dude up top was complaining about the size,not the offroading ability.Its safer then just about any car out there.
To be able to tackle rugged terrains and offroading courses, the cars must come equipped, the Escalade is far from equipped for offroad duties. The only luxury SUV's that can handle the offroad duties are the Range Rover, H1, Touareg, Grand Cherokee and Cayenne.

Many times people have tried taking H2's and Tahoes off road, in the weakest of conditions and had to be towed home- these are the Escalades cousins.

The sole purpose of these big things is to be taken offroad, if you want a luxury car, what is wrong wth a Deville??? Or one of the even better German marques luxury saloon??? Not only are you being more considerate to others around you, you're probably drinking less of mother natures resources.

The most stolen vehicle in America is the 1988 Toyota Camry, are you going to call them desirable???

The Maybach is pointless, as is the Veyron, as is pretty much any car over 6.0 liters, 5.5 meters or 2200 Kg's.


/nd it's not safer than any car out there, roll it over and unless you have a roll cage, then you're more than likely to be dead or seriously injured and yes, you can roll any SUV, no matter how many ESP programs they stuff into them.

To be able to tackle rugged terrains and offroading courses, the cars must come equipped, the Escalade is far from equipped for offroad duties. The only luxury SUV's that can handle the offroad duties are the Range Rover, H1, Touareg, Grand Cherokee and Cayenne.

Many times people have tried taking H2's and Tahoes off road, in the weakest of conditions and had to be towed home- these are the Escalades cousins.

The sole purpose of these big things is to be taken offroad, if you want a luxury car, what is wrong wth a Deville??? Or one of the even better German marques luxury saloon??? Not only are you being more considerate to others around you, you're probably drinking less of mother natures resources.

The most stolen vehicle in America is the 1988 Toyota Camry, are you going to call them desirable???

The Maybach is pointless, as is the Veyron, as is pretty much any car over 6.0 liters, 5.5 meters or 2200 Kg's.


/nd it's not safer than any car out there, roll it over and unless you have a roll cage, then you're more than likely to be dead or seriously injured and yes, you can roll any SUV, no matter how many ESP programs they stuff into them.

So your saying that anyone who owns a SUV should take it off-roading?No,Cadillac did not build the Escalade with off-roading in mind.If you want to do off-roading get a Wrangler or a Hummer,or any other SUV that was built specifically FOR off-roading.Find me one Escalade owner that bought there Escalade and tride taking it off-roading.Its gonna be hard.The Escalade is for people that have taste in luxury and BIG SUV's.A person may not want to buy a luxury car just because you tell them they should because to you SUV's are only made for off-roading and whether its luxury or not is regardless in your opinion.

I will say again,I could care less about gasoline,read my other post,Im not typing it again.

Jim,its a RATED FACT that the escalade is the most stolen vehicle in America.Where you got 1988 Camry is beyond me,but thats kinda stupid.I would boost a damnFord Aspire before one of those.

I don't see whats so pointless about large engines.Oh boo hoo,they suck gas.Cry me a river.Every vehicle in this world suck gas,maybe not as much as these massive engines,but they do.If your so worried about gas consumption,then take a bike to work everyday.And maybe hug a tree on the way.

I never said that Stabi Track makes an SUV invinsinble to rolling.I said that it helps prevent rolling,there is a difference.Unless you roll over a cliff,your probably not going to be kill if you roll a Escalade.Id feel a lot safer in a huge SUV then an econo box.You hit a dear with one ofthem tiny things the engine is either in the back seat or the anters are through the windsheild.Safe,huh.A guy a coach with has a daughter that did drive a Jeep cherokee,rolled it(as I said,Jeeps roll like nothing else),wait,let me correct myself,FLIPPED it end over end 6 times,came out with a scratch on her neck from the seat belt.The Jeep was destroyed but she was fine.SUV's are safer then cars,nothing will change my opinion on that.

Please excuse my spelling errors,I just woke up.And after just reading that I see there are a lot.Thanks.

I don't get it, there is honestly no point to this car- Cadillac already have a full size luxury car, so why jack one up, make it completely obnoxious and inconsiderate to other users???

The SUV concept is for off-roaders- always has been- always will be. It screams out "Small dick!!!" The drivers think they can use thier tank to push other drivers around- but I don't fall for it- if they hit me- thier at fault, they pay.

Ever had an SUV come up behind you with the lights on, making looking in the rear view mirror impossible?? I have, ever seen an SUV crash into the back of a car and cause senseless damage to the other car??? I have. Don't get me started on the dangers they pose to pedestrians.


They are not safer than normal cars, at all- the NRMA, Euro NCAP and NHTSA all have crash tested SUV's, I haven't seen one do as good as a Volvo, Saab or Renault. The Escalade ESV onlt holds a three star rating for passenger-side frontal-impacts and an EXT- a three star for frontal drivers-side impacts- as you see here- http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/testing/ncap/Cars/2004SUVs.html So it's all a myth.

In response to Jimster:


"I'm taller than you HandodDoom and I get into most cars comfortably, I've owned many small cars, from a Prelude to a Yugo, to a Corolla and so on and I fit in them pretty damn comfortably thank you, there is absolutely no need for an SUV for the case of passenger room."


Thats your opinion. As for me I am 6 foot 5 inches and can't comfortably stretch out on long trips in small cars like the Corolla.


"My BIGGEST problem with the Escalade is that it has absolutely no purpose, it has about as much off road ability as a CTS, has an obnoxiously high center of gravity, is prone to roll over and bleeds the earth of it's fuel, due to the fact that it's heavy and has a pointlessly large motor."


It isn't made for heavy off roading, it is made for light off road use. It is more useful for towing and hauling large loads.


"Now for the price of an Escalade, as a matter of fact cheaper, you can get a VW Touareg V10 TDI, have a hell of a lot more Torque, pull as much as a Ram and go offroading with the best of them, oh and it's diesel, so with sensible driving 25 mpg would be easily possible. Oh and it has an excellent on-road ride as well."


The Toureg isn't offered as a diesel in America as far as I know. So here the Escalade has a more power.


"The Escalades survive only on the premise that"

"1. They are aimed at middle aged men trying to extend thier ego, because they can't extend a certain thing down low."


We don't need to know your own personal problems.

"2. Rappers and Wiggas who want to be bling bling y0!!! and waste thier money on crap."

Cadillac did a good job in advertising. They held parties for celebrities and let them drive the vehicles.

"Or dumb suburban bitches who have two kids, who are weedier than most kids whose parents drive Geos and want to waste precious parking room and waste everybodies time."


Those dumb bitches drive bigger vehicles because they need room to carry grocery and kids around. Anyways the parking spots in America are big enough to accomodate bigger vehicles.


Questions Jimster, do you have anything good to say about American made vehicles.

In response to Jimster:


"The sole purpose of these big things is to be taken offroad, if you want a luxury car, what is wrong wth a Deville??? Or one of the even better German marques luxury saloon??? Not only are you being more considerate to others around you, you're probably drinking less of mother natures resources."


Many SUVs are not made to be full fledged off roaders. "Or one of the even better german marques luxury saloon" get this out of your head, there are better cars out there than the German and Italian made cars. Cadillac is just as good in quality if you look at the new vehicles coming out.


"The most stolen vehicle in America is the 1988 Toyota Camry, are you going to call them desirable???"


Ironically the Escalade is actually the most stolen vehicle in America.


"The Maybach is pointless, as is the Veyron, as is pretty much any car over 6.0 liters, 5.5 meters or 2200 Kg's."


Since when did we start talking about cars.


and it's not safer than any car out there, roll it over and unless you have a roll cage, then you're more than likely to be dead or seriously injured and yes, you can roll any SUV, no matter how many ESP programs they stuff into them."


The land rover is recorded to roll over more than the Escalade"

Yeah right, Suburban Soccer-mums really need the space to carry groceries and kids. Newsflash Einstein- My mum has been getting around with Honda Civics for a good while now takes more than enough groceries and has lugged around our family of 3 kids effortlessly. Well us kids have now become Teens and my dads VW Passat sedan handles the family transport stuff easily.

There are not better cars than German or Italian cars- There is no luxury car better than an Audi RS6 or Mercedes Benz E55 AMG. Or the Maserati Quattroporte. Yet alone an S600L or 760Li.


And there are numerous SUV's better than an Escalade- almost all of them as a matter of fact.

Posted by Moss1O6GTi - 02-04-2004 at 12:50 AMI don't get it, there is honestly no point to this car- Cadillac already have a full size luxury car, so why jack one up, make it completely obnoxious and inconsiderate to other users???

The SUV concept is for off-roaders- always has been- always will be. It screams out "Small dick!!!" The drivers think they can use thier tank to push other drivers around- but I don't fall for it- if they hit me- thier at fault, they pay.

Ever had an SUV come up behind you with the lights on, making looking in the rear view mirror impossible?? I have, ever seen an SUV crash into the back of a car and cause senseless damage to the other car??? I have. Don't get me started on the dangers they pose to pedestrians.


They are not safer than normal cars, at all- the NRMA, Euro NCAP and NHTSA all have crash tested SUV's, I haven't seen one do as good as a Volvo, Saab or Renault. The Escalade ESV onlt holds a three star rating for passenger-side frontal-impacts and an EXT- a three star for frontal drivers-side impacts- as you see here- http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/testi...s/2004SUVs.html (http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/testing/ncap/Cars/2004SUVs.html) So it's all a myth.

Did you even bother to read my other posts where me and Jim discussed this?Some people like huge SUV's rather then cars.You know,Merc and BMW have full size luxury cars,and they build a SUV,but nobody bitches about them.Why is that?They may not be as big but there still quite large.And how is it obnoctious and inconsiderate to other users?They don't bother me at all.

I guess you can say that Cadillac invented a new genre on SUV then.Because they did not build this to be a off-roader.Like it or not,they didn't.And I will mention this again,because you didnt read any of my other posts,either that or your just ignorant,but show me a person that has taken their Escalade off-roading.Like I said,you want to go off-roading?Get yourself a Land Rover or Hummer.There made for off-roading.One more thing,Im sure anybody that hits you with their Escalade,Im sure the repairs would be pocket change for them.

Ok,next,I have had ALL KINDS of cars come up behind me with there high beams on.Its not just a Escalade driver thing.Thats why they have that little nob on the mirror,what you do is push it and it puts the mirror at an angle so you can see just fine.Or if you have a luxury car,such as a Caddy,it dims the mirror for you.Now that you know how to do this you no longer have nothing to cry about.You are not the brightest thing that ever walked the earth are you.Ive seen freakin Aspires rearend cars.Again,its just not a Escalade driver thing.They call these people dumbasses who shouldn't be allowed to driveAnd what auto doesn't pose dangers to pedestrians?Infact,ready for some common sense?Infact,your more likely to be hit by a small car then a Escalade.Reason being,you can probably see a huge Escalade comming around a corning or whereever better then you can a small car.

So your saying you would rather go head on with a Ford Excursion in a Honda Accord rather then a Escalade?Or be side swiped by a Excursion in a Accord rather then a Escalade?Or be hit by any other tye of vehicle in any other car rather then a Escalade?God help you then.

And gonuts,you basically restated everything I had already said,may I ask why?

And gonuts,you basically restated everything I had already said,may I ask why?



It was 3 in the morning, and I didn't realize that you had said the same exact stuff as I did until I posted it. Sorry.

Cars that pose a reduced threat to pedestrians???


The 2000+ Honda Civic 5 Door Hatch
2002 + Honda CRV
1998 + Daihatsu Sirion
2003 + MG TF

All these have scored 3 out of a possible 4 stars in the Euro NCAP pedestrian vs car crash test.

Well really I don't have to worry about being hit by an Excursion- they are not sold in New Zealand- nor is the Escalade. The Jeep range and Ford Explorer are the only US-made SUV's on sale here. But I am attacking SUV's in general- the lot of them are a pain in the ass, nobody uses them for what they are intended for any more.


NOBODY has a valid reason to buy an SUV, need lots of seats??? An MPV will seat the extra passengers more comfortably. Need to take it off road??? Then you need one, so get a Land Rover, Jeep or Touareg. Need lots of load space??? A Station wagon or Sedan can more than hold up to those demands. Need to spend your dollars on looking overly stupid for purchasing something you don't need?? Then buy an SUV, by all means.


SUV's are inconsiderate in the fact that the bumpers over-ride where most cars have been designed to safely take a hit- this is why occupants are safer when a car hits a Semi, than an SUV. So incondierate??? I'd say so. By the way, I dim my rear view mirror when there are SUV's behind me- but it still annoys me and I can't exaclty drive with the mirror like that for god-knows how many km's.

Topic Review (Newest First)Posted by Moss1O6GTi - 02-04-2004 at 07:48 PMCars that pose a reduced threat to pedestrians???


The 2000+ Honda Civic 5 Door Hatch
2002 + Honda CRV
1998 + Daihatsu Sirion
2003 + MG TF

All these have scored 3 out of a possible 4 stars in the Euro NCAP pedestrian vs car crash test.

Well really I don't have to worry about being hit by an Excursion- they are not sold in New Zealand- nor is the Escalade. The Jeep range and Ford Explorer are the only US-made SUV's on sale here. But I am attacking SUV's in general- the lot of them are a pain in the ass, nobody uses them for what they are intended for any more.


NOBODY has a valid reason to buy an SUV, need lots of seats??? An MPV will seat the extra passengers more comfortably. Need to take it off road??? Then you need one, so get a Land Rover, Jeep or Touareg. Need lots of load space??? A Station wagon or Sedan can more than hold up to those demands. Need to spend your dollars on looking overly stupid for purchasing something you don't need?? Then buy an SUV, by all means.


SUV's are inconsiderate in the fact that the bumpers over-ride where most cars have been designed to safely take a hit- this is why occupants are safer when a car hits a Semi, than an SUV. So incondierate??? I'd say so. By the way, I dim my rear view mirror when there are SUV's behind me- but it still annoys me and I can't exaclty drive with the mirror like that for god-knows how many km's.

Well,ofcourse someones gonna be destroyed if hit by an SUV but you more likely to see a SUV comming your way rather then a small car so you can get out of the way.

You know what I meant when I asked you the Excursion question.In your next reply,can you answer it?Where you sayin before the you would rather get into a major accident with a SUV in a small car rather then a Escalade?

Saying that noone has a reason to buy one is like saying a single man or woman who lives by him or herself dont have a reason to buy a car that seats more than one person,that they should be driving aroung a motorcycle.Thats retarded.I don't have a reason to own 4 cars,but I do.But you got to think about other people's driving preferences.A lot of SUV drivers would laugh in your face if the heard you say that.Me,I dont like minivans and wouldn't be caught dead in a station wagon.Some people love them though.But some people like riding 5 feet off the ground.They don't necessarily need one,but hell,nobody needs a computer in there house either.

Moss,its COMMON SENSE that a Escalade would be safer then most cars.If your in a Honda Civic,your DEFINATLY dead head on with something much bigger then you,such as a SUV.And where you come up with the idea that your safer in a car when you hit a semi then a Escalade just might be the funniest thing I have read on here.You don't hit an semi in a car,you get run over,crushed,smushed,demolished,whatever.But if you truley believe that,then I truley thing theres something wrong with you.You are not safer in a car then a SUV when in a accident with a semi.Thats just retarded to say.

You dim your mirror,good job.Why are you bitchen like your the only one it happens to and gets frustrated over it?Are you the only person in NZ that owns a car?Everyone has a SUV.Or is it only SUV's that come with headlights?Because your saying the only type of vehicle that blinds you are SUV's.I have more cars then SUV's do that to me.I like to piss them off though when they do it.I'll slow down to about 45 in a 55 zone and when they try to pass me I'll speed back up to 60 or 65.pretty fun.Gets them really pissed of.:lol:

Hey, to each his/her own; as far as whether SUVs such as the Escalade serve any purpose at all--well, the same could be said for any of the Euro 12-cylinder sedans (can you say BMW? MB? VW? 'Cuz there aren't any domestic 12-cyl. sedans currently offered...); why would there be a need for a 12-cylinder sedan when a decent-sized and tuned six-cylinder one should suffice nicely?

Hey, I'm just playing devil's advocate--I'm not trying to choose sides. :biggrin:

Theres no need for a 12 cylinder,your very right.Theres no need for cars period.Theres no need for TVs,PCs or a lot of anything else people own and are out there.That don't mean its a bad thing.Theres nothing wrong with a huge SUV,or a 12 cylinder BMW,or a 16 cylinder Bugatti.But there out there,and as the years go on,technology will continue to spoil mankind.

You logic astounds me still :Eek7:


The Civic sized Renault Megane has a better safety rating than any SUV I can think of, as does the Saab 9-3, Renault Laguna, Merc-Benz C Class and Toyota Avensis- which are all smaller than an Altima- so yeah I'd rather be in one of them- the technology that is Crumple zones, Airbags and Collapsable structures has advanced safety to all kinds of extremes- nowadays the car absorbs the impact- NOT the passenger. However thanks to SUV bumpers over-riding the cars designed crumple zones we are all in danger. Thanks a fucking lot.

Of course the risk posed with getting hit by a Semi is minimal, the drivers know what they are doing and have been trained with thier vehicle, very few SUV owners fall into that catagorey. But still the fact that the bumpers simply hit the car in it's crumple zones the car collapses and everyone is usually safe, if they are in a car with well designed safety mechansisms.


As for the headlights issue- the height of the SUV means that the lights are pointed directly at my rear vision mirror, while in other cars the light is mainly hitting my back bumper and bootlid. Why you can't comprehend that is beyond me.

You logic astounds me still :Eek7:


The Civic sized Renault Megane has a better safety rating than any SUV I can think of, as does the Saab 9-3, Renault Laguna, Merc-Benz C Class and Toyota Avensis- which are all smaller than an Altima- so yeah I'd rather be in one of them- the technology that is Crumple zones, Airbags and Collapsable structures has advanced safety to all kinds of extremes- nowadays the car absorbs the impact- NOT the passenger. However thanks to SUV bumpers over-riding the cars designed crumple zones we are all in danger. Thanks a fucking lot.

Of course the risk posed with getting hit by a Semi is minimal, the drivers know what they are doing and have been trained with thier vehicle, very few SUV owners fall into that catagorey. But still the fact that the bumpers simply hit the car in it's crumple zones the car collapses and everyone is usually safe, if they are in a car with well designed safety mechansisms.


As for the headlights issue- the height of the SUV means that the lights are pointed directly at my rear vision mirror, while in other cars the light is mainly hitting my back bumper and bootlid. Why you can't comprehend that is beyond me.

Yes,those cars are safer than other cars of the same size.But something the size of a Civic...its just impossible to be safer in an accident then a Escalade.Size plays a big part here.If you hit a tree at 60 mph in a Renault your car will be destroyed.And you probably won't look to good either.If you hit a tree in a Escaade at 60 mph though your truck isnt going to look but you might come out with a scratch or two.You are in less danger in a Escalade then you are in a Civic size anythinghile driving.

Yeah,there trained alright,thats why I see them of the road all the time.Talk about asshole drivers,they always fly past you on the highway during winter storms at 75mph.Safe drivers?If you panic in storms,which a lot of people do,then a semi flying past you can very easily wipe you off the road.Ive seen it. Ive seen them off the road because they drive like madmen in winter storms.I see it all the time.These people may be trained but rarely use their skills.Semi drivers are the assholes of the road.And I still disagree with you that you are safer head on in a small car,or large size car then you are in a Escalade.Size plays a bigger part then crumple zones.

About the headlights,are you trying tell me that the only vehicle that has blined you is a SUV?Bullshit.Cars blind you too.And you try to make this issue the SUV's fault.Is it not the driver of the SUV that chooses to leave his highbeams on?Last I knew all cars need a driver to opperate,am I wrong?Now,why can't you comprehend that?

HandofDoom--I applaud the last sentence in your previous post (the one right before this); all this talk about this car being safer than that car or SUV doesn't mean jack squat if the person operating this "highly safety-rated" vehicle can't drive worth sh*t...and there are plenty such drivers here in the U.S. As a motorcycle rider, I see this all the time...

And you know what else, HoD? You're right about another thing--there shouldn't be any need for cars period. In many big cities, emissions from cars/trucks/SUVs isn't the only big issue as far as transportation is concerned; there can be millions of green vehicles out there but that won't guarantee that you won't get stuck in traffic.

Your right,if your a crappy driver,its not very much safer.But its still safer than a car.If your a piss poor driver your still safer in a Escalade then a Pontiac Grand Prix.There are a lot of poeple out there that should not be allowed to drive.The road tests these days,a 6 year old could pass one.

I just get sick of reading this!!!!

I have nothing against any car... don't like them all but that's just a matter of taste...

So I'm not here to say the Escalade or what ever SUV is stupid or useless...
Drive what you like....

BUT don't start saying the SUV is the the savest cars around, cause they are not!
The EuroNCAP tests are for all types of cars and are all rated the same way! driver safety, passenger and pedestrian safety...

and the best cars for now are the Renaults and Saab volvo and now also the Toyota Avensis... they ARE safer than a SUV!

I worked for Toyota as a salesman, (just started as a drivng instructor)
and had the pleasure of testing the cars, and during the test one of the cars crashed... (preproduction models, had antilock brake error, and the driver was stupid enough to test it and kicked the brake and started a slide...and hit a tree with 60MPH) all passangers came out without a scratch...! one didn't even wearn his seatbelt...(stupid OK)

so don't start about safety (euro and Japanse cars Are safer!)

so plz have a little peace here

...so don't start about safety (euro and Japanse cars Are safer!)

so plz have a little peace here
Considering that quite a few of the Euro and Japanese-make cars cost in the high five-figures (dollar-wise)...one would hope that they would be. Yes I know there are some such cars that are just as safe yet don't cost an arm and a leg to afford, but...I say this because some of the cars you mentioned aren't anywhere near as expensive as the high-end MB, BMW, or Toyota/Lexus offerings...yet apparently they have a higher safety rating (I infer this from your statement in your previous reply) than these expensive sedans.

Here's something to ponder--does the apparent fact that these Euro and Japanese cars that you claim are safer (than non-Euro or Japanese, I assume?) lull a driver of such a vehicle into a false sense of invulnerability...i.e., because such a vehicle is so much safer, he (or she) may drive a bit more "offensively" knowing that if he gets into a perilous situation, his much safer Euro or Japanese vehicle may reduce the possibility said person and/or his passenger(s) getting injured or killed.

Oh yeah--safety notwithstanding, if say a Toyota Avensis (can't say I'm familiar with that since it appears to be a non-U.S. model, but I will guess that it ain't a SUV) and a Cadillac Escalade or similar large SUV were to collide (head-on, side, or rear impact--pick your poison) at say, 30 mph...which vehicle do you think will sustain more damage?

I don't want anybody to know you are invulnerabil, nobody is! I am a driving instructor and teacher (just gratuated) and teach
every student to drive good and SAFE! so don't start on me about invulnerability,
And yes we do drive a lot faster here in europe than in the US and canada, but that does not make us unsafer drivers...

If you like to know what a toyota avensis is:
this is a link to the English site: (so you understand it)
www.toyota.co.uk

and select "see the range" and choose the Avensis

btw the prices of the toyota's and Renault's arent that high like a for instance Escalade.
the starting price of a Toyota avensis is: 23.250 Euro (about the same in USD (to make it easy))

head on colision.... or any colision EASY.... I would go for the toyota!!(or other 5 star cars...)
it has 9 airbags and all possible safety feature...like spacial safetycage etc( don't want to bother you with the specs) most important: good brakes!!! which wil often safe you before a crash!
the difirence is these car absorb the impact, a big suv does not it stays almost intact, so you take the blow of the impact,

The only problem is, the High ground cleanance of the SUV's which alows it to crash ontop of other cars...

I hope you understand it a little now...

so Im not saying the escalade is a bad car ot any suv is a bad car, how usefull it is...

I you like and drive it I'm happy for you, don't get me wrong...

The Stig

Just so that there's no confusion--I didn't say or imply that Euro drivers were unsafe; rather, that there are some people out there who may feel a bit more "invincible"-like because they're driving a vehicle that may be more highly-rated, safety-wise, than typical. IOW--a driver in such a safer vehicle may drive a bit less cautiously (i.e., aggressively) than if he were in a vehicle that may not offer as much crash protection.

Bottom line--some vehicles may offer much better safety protection than others, but no vehicle can make a guarantee that its' occupants will survive any and every type of vehicular catastrophe. As you pointed out, not even a vehicle as highly-rated as the Avensis will protect you from serious harm if some huge SUV or tractor-trailer crashes on top of it.

You want to hear some irony regarding cars vs. SUVs as far as safety/crash-protection is concerned? Given that some people (like yourself) have argued that in general, cars offer better occupant protection than SUVs if involved in a crash--why would such car owners (I'm not saying that you're one of them) be worried about what might happen to them if their vehicle get involved in a collision with an SUV, as opposed to if they got hit by another car? You hear this complaint quite a bit here in the U.S.--how car occupants have no chance if they get hit by an SUV...

In any case, please don't take my comments as anti-car (or pro-SUV). :iceslolan

Non taken!

I think we should all buy a nice T-Ford!!! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

so we feel al unsafe and can't exceed 30MPH...

:D

I don't know about you but I'd MUCH rather be in a Escalade then a Avensis during a head on wreck.Yet alone with a large SUV.Your crazy if you wouldn't.Its the size that matters in this case.Your safer in a Escalade then you are in a small car.

We know that now OK,

and I'm not impressed...with the cars safety performance....

and I am not going to say it again...

check the stats before you say something...

And I am not saying the escalade or any suv is a unsafe car...or what so ever

A friend of mine has just imported a Escalade, just because he has a lot of bling bling :2cents: and he likes to know it,
they are not for sale in europe....mainly because they are not wanted here... suv in specific...not enough space and lot of useless space in car... (NOT PERSONAL)

OK back to a little peace here...

Nothing will change my opinion.Use common sense.A car would be crushed in a accident with a full size SUV.A full size SUV hitting anothe full size SUV wouldnt be as bad.A full size SUV is by far safer then a car.

that's because you are one stubbern American who thinks everything american is better....

:rofl:

end of story from my side...

Your making no sense.Bigger is safer,a car that is 4 times a size of another car is going to be much safer.Again,common sense.It amazes me how mindless people can be.
And I don't think everything American is better.Im not American biased.I just get frustrated listening to someone like you.The best air bags in the world won't do squat in a accident if your car turns out like a crumpled wad of paper.

Your making no sense.Bigger is safer,a car that is 4 times a size of another car is going to be much safer.Again,common sense.It amazes me how mindless people can be.
And I don't think everything American is better.Im not American biased.I just get frustrated listening to someone like you.The best air bags in the world won't do squat in a accident if your car turns out like a crumpled wad of paper.
Wrong again.


If your car folds like paper in an accident, usually the structure of the car is collapsing as designed, while inside the "safety cell" is left completely intact, the airbags simply cushion impact.

Now lets say an Avensis or Laguna hits an Escalade or Navigator, the damage will be evident on the 5 star sedan, but the occupants will be unhurt, unless hit by flying glass, it's called engineering. While the SUV with a lesser rigid safety cell (RElying on the wieght of the car) if hit at about 60mph WILL also collapse, if the safety cell isn't strong enough the interior will fold, the occupants of the SUV run a much higher risk of Torso head and leg injuries than those in the more structurally rigid car.

And yes the safety cells in these cars are designed to withstand all kinds of impacts.


The times have changed, this isn't 15 years ago, the wieght of a car no longer determines who comes out best.

I see what you mean.But it can't save you in any kind of accident.Ive seen mangled cars where theres basically nothing left.Or the roof was collaspe.In a case like that the air bags could smother you to death,if the roof where to collaspe.Don't get me wrong,Im not saying the cars are unsafe.I realize Renalts and Volvos are among the safest you can get and their technology blows me away.Im not saying that American is better either.I just would rather be in a Escalade in a accident.The Escalade also has front,side curtain,and side impact air bags.A Escalade just won't come out as mangled as a car.No matter how safe the car is,if its hit bad enough,the cabin would be crush too.Same thing with a Ecalade or any other big SUV.ITs just going to take more for to crush the cabin.What I mean is a much worse accident before your legs began to crush.Ive seen cars where the engine ands up in the drivers lap,what I mean is in the cabin.And that means your pretty much dead.What Im trying to say is that airbags and todays safety technology isnt invinsible to any accident.Not yet anyway.

They made something for that also.... :D

the engine is going under the driver in a frontal crash...it's going downwords...

but your are right in some ways, Every car has a breaking point, no car will win from a train you always loose a crash like that...
there just are crahsed no car survives...

Think it also matters where you are, so see wich car is better,
so I am not saying it is a unsafe car, cause there are not bad cars, exept the real small asian maybe...

:grinno:

They made something for that also.... :D

the engine is going under the driver in a frontal crash...it's going downwords...

but your are right in some ways, Every car has a breaking point, no car will win from a train you always loose a crash like that...
there just are crahsed no car survives...

Think it also matters where you are, so see wich car is better,
so I am not saying it is a unsafe car, cause there are not bad cars, exept the real small asian maybe...

:grinno:
Hyundais have been terrible in crashes, in my experienxes........;)

Why can't we just all get along...?

I drive an 03 Silverado...why? Because that's what I wanted to drive. It was $42k, drinks a ton of gas, and will crush an camry that gets in it's way...sounds to me like a lot of people want to pick on escalade owners b/c they can't afford one or b/c they're an environmentalist...they're not the one to pick one. Trust me, I get way worse gas mileage and my truck cost almost as much...

Why can't we just all get along...?

I drive an 03 Silverado...why? Because that's what I wanted to drive. It was $42k, drinks a ton of gas, and will crush an camry that gets in it's way...sounds to me like a lot of people want to pick on escalade owners b/c they can't afford one or b/c they're an environmentalist...they're not the one to pick one. Trust me, I get way worse gas mileage and my truck cost almost as much...



Well said.

...The Escalade also has front,side curtain,and side impact air bags...
Side curtain airbags? It does???? Didn't see anything on Cadillac's website about the Escalade line having side curtain airbags as either standard or optional...

last time I checked Escalade doesnt drive itself nor does Hundai, toyota, etc.... doesnt matter how safe or unsafe a car/truck it. Its the driver that causes accidents!! If you put a careless jacka$$ behind a small car, he or she is just as dangerous as a good dirver behind a larger truck/suv. So dont blame the SUV, blame the $hithead driver. And if your care about safty so much, why would you say something like buy a smaller car and race your friend!?!?!?!

Man, i wish i could have said it better. Why buy an American piece when you can buy a better quality truck for the same price. Meaning imports like the Volvo or even the Volkswagon Tourege.

Everyones talking about how SUV are so dangerous, well what about these little economy cars like the Toyota Prius or the Echo, or even the Mini. These things are just as dangerous to me, a shopping cart can run into one of these cars and the next thing you know half your cars gone and you get a bill for twice as much as the cars worth on repairs. I would be fearing for my life if a golf cart hit me in one of these tin cans.

Man, i wish i could have said it better. Why buy an American piece when you can buy a better quality truck for the same price. Meaning imports like the Volvo or even the Volkswagon Tourege.


You know you're right...why buy American? Why support US industry...? Why even live here? Why don't you move to Europe?

Some of us like to buy American...besides, there's nothing shabby about an escalade, and I'd prefer the ride/style over many of the European competitors...

I actually choose to drive an 03 Silverado, but respect the Escalade for what it is...

Does this mean that I don't respect VW or Volvo? Certainly not! Volvo has invented many wonderful safety devices for the automotive industry and we're all better off for it...VW offers good value for what you spend, but in my opinion, neither are as classy or ride as nicely as an Escalade...

Lets get one thing straight. I am an American who just happens to like American vehicles, except the Escalade. Most people nowadays CAN buy one. That doesnt mean they will just because they can. They would or lets say i would buy something worth the money. Im not dissin Escalades, ill admit, i used to like them. Theyre just way over priced. When i rode in one with my friend, it felt like i was in a truck. Some people like that. For $50.000 i would think that they could better the ride. At least like an Isuzu Rodeo.

Over priced?Please,the God damn Maybach is overpriced.I could'nt give a rats ass about whether its a Maybach or a friggen Geo.NO car is worth 350 grand.Remember,its a car.a hunk of metal that rolls.Thats all any car is.No car is worth over 100 grand.But thats what you got to pay if you want one.The Escalade is not overpriced,no way in hell compared to everthing else out there.And quality?An Escalade is just as good as a VW.Take it from someone whos driven Caddys all his life,there just as good as any BMW or Mercedes out there.If you want to talk about a SUV that has poor quality and is overpriced for its quality,go visit the Lincoln Navigator forums.And just so you know,Ive driven a Toureg.The ride is not better then that of an Escalade.Again,Escalades are worth the 55 grand.A Rolls Royce,Bently, or Maybach are not worth their price.I don't care if there hand built or not.Think this through before you post again,what an Escalade goes for and what other cars go for.

I stiil thinks its over priced. To eaches own. Those $100 thousand dollar + cars can kiss my ass. peace.

Lets get one thing straight. I am an American who just happens to like American vehicles, except the Escalade. Most people nowadays CAN buy one. That doesnt mean they will just because they can. They would or lets say i would buy something worth the money. Im not dissin Escalades, ill admit, i used to like them. Theyre just way over priced. When i rode in one with my friend, it felt like i was in a truck. Some people like that. For $50.000 i would think that they could better the ride. At least like an Isuzu Rodeo.


Surprice, they ride like a truck...that's what they are! I happen to like the ride in my truck, it's more comfortable than most vehicles I've been in...but dont' confuse the ride of a modern truck with one of years gone by. And, just for the record, you'll never see me in a Rodeo...

The Rodeo thing was a figure of speach. They are truely a piece. Trucks years ago gave me headaches out the...

Cause i cant stand falling into a seat in a car.

As much as liberals can't stand real freedom----everyone should drive what they want to drive. It is their business.

Jim,its a RATED FACT that the escalade is the most stolen vehicle in America.Where you got 1988 Camry is beyond me,but thats kinda stupid.I would boost a damnFord Aspire before one of those.

Im sorry but the toyota camry is the most stolen car in us. Thats y all new one come with lowjack at no extra cost they have been the most stolen car for years

Top Vehicle Thefts by Year, Make, and Model

1989 Toyota Camry 1994 Honda Accord 2000 Honda Civic 1992 Chevrolet Full Size C/K Pickup 1997 Ford Full Size Pickup (150/250/350) 1993 Jeep Cherokee/Grand Cherokee 1986 Oldsmobile Cutlass/Supreme/Ciera 1994 Dodge Caravan/Grand Caravan 1996 Ford Taurus 2001 Toyota Corolla
Source: National Crime Information Center you were getting your sorces from model year production vechiels you needed to get the list i have provided

Wrong,its actually...
#1.Cadillac Escalade
#2.Dodge Stratus
#3.Mitsubishi Mirage
#4.Jeep Wrangler
#5.Lincoln Navigator 2WD
#6.Dodge Intrepid
#7.Lincoln Navigator 4WD
#8.Dodge Ram 1500 Series
#9.Ford Expedition 2WD
#10.Chrysler Sebring

Source:Highway Lost Data Institute

It only makes sense.If I were to steal a car it would be one of those of a '89 Camry.

Over a '89 Camry**

Let's think a second.......


1989 Camry.

Easy to steal
Much more of them around than Escalades
Easy to flog off parts for moola
Low chance of recovery.

The 1989 Camry suddenly sounds more attractive to thieves....

Lets think another second...

Cadillac Escalade.

For a pro car thief,no car is hard to steal.
You can find a Escalade anywhere you go.Especially big cities,which is where the first place Id be if I was a pro in the business.
Your going to make a lot more off of parts chopping up an Escalade than you would a '89 Camry.

Professional car thieves dont steal cars that are 15 years old.No body wants them anymore.The cars that I listed are more in demand.Thats why there the most stolen cars in the country.

Jumping in late on this thread, but I have an issue regarding how the rankings stated above are being interpreted--just because the 1989 Toyota Camry may very well be the most stolen car according to whatever source doesn't necessarily--if not logically--mean that the Toyota Camry itself is the most-stolen vehicle. I mean, there have been more stolen Honda Accords, period, than 1989 Camrys--should that fact be interpreted to mean that it's the Accord and not the Camry that's the number-one stolen model? Plus, if the Camry is indeed the most-stolen vehicle, should it really matter what model year it is (since the first list specifically mentioned 1989 Toyota Camry)?

In a nutshell--there is a distinct and obvious difference in meaning between saying that "the 1989 Camry is the most-stolen vehicle" vs. saying that "the Camry is the most-stolen vehicle."

does anyone else jsut wanna bitchslap HandofDoom?