This car was spotted on a french road. Some of you a probably familiar with this pic because I have seen it a few times but didn't know what the deal was with it. Pic: http://www.passion-auto.com/jbrowser/Mc_Laren/MC%20LAREN%20F1%20photo%2003.JPG

Whats the deal with the headlights? I think I've heard before that this is an LM prototype but I don't know where I got that info. If it was a prototype, wouldn't it be Papaya Orange? Anybody have any more pics of it? More info please!

EDIT: Now that I look at the pic, it appears that it's a road car with the downforce kit....but that doesn't explain the headlights...

No - there was only one LM prototype - XP1LM - and it was most certainly Paypaya Orange.

This car is a the "R66 MCL" plated car. It is a road car with the high downforce kit. It has what I believe to be an early design for HID headlights, with the HID mounted on the outboard position as opposed to the inboard one like the other F1s I've seen with HIDs. Not sure why they chose the rectangular lamp for the inboard position - it does look weird.

This may have been the silver car that was at the factory getting serviced when tvrfreak took his photos. There's no plate on the car there and no shot of the front end unfortunately, so we really can't tell.

>8^)
ER

Isn't this car owned by Michael Schumachers brother?

That's all speculation - there's no hard evidence that is factual at all, at least none that I have seen.

The thing is there are two F1s that were spotted and photographed at the Monaco Grand Prix - tvrfreak had originally reported that here:

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=109674

I posted the larger photos, and that's all we have seen of them.

I think the only reason tvrfreak suggested the Schumacher brothers is because of the location and the coincidence on the license plates. I don't believe he has any additional info to suggest that is really the case.

Also, how would it look for Michael (and his brother's name is Ralf btw) to own a car produced by the company of his teams rival? I think that might not sit so well with the men in charge at Ferrari. Regardless of how much I would love to be able to say that Michael Schumacher owns a McLaren F1, I really don't believe it's true. Whether Ralf would have one after his stint in the Japan GT series in '96 remains a possibility, but is certainly not guaranteed. If someone else knows more than that, please share! :cool:

>8^)
ER

Do you have any idea of that the # for R66 could be?

Seems much more likely to me that the cars (or the private number plates at least) belong to McLaren, hence both end with MCL (McLaren Cars Limited). Who do we know at McLaren with first names satrting with and R and with an M? I think Ron (Dennis) and Mansour (Ojjeh) are the more likely owners.

interesting but now there are 5 cars that mansour is meant to own. It could be coincidence.

It could be that McLaren registered the number plates and switch them between cars in their possesion.

Or, it could be that the owner of said McLaren's wanted "MCL" on their plates similar to how other owners have ordered personalized plates for their cars with some variation on the word "McLaren"

Isn't speculation fun. :iceslolan

>8^)
ER

yep, it is. But not as fun as working it all out. Any idea of the chassis numbers? M66 is a GTR so it should be fairly easy to work out. Perhaps 07R? Which other GTRs were converted? R66 is harder as it is painted the all to common magnesium silver. But with number plates like those it's fairly certain that both cars are registered in Britain.

I still reckon both cars belong to McLaren. The first letter of the plates being the owners first initial, the 66 being the year McLaren scored their first world championship points and MCL for McLaren Cars Limited.

I don't know the chassis number on the 'M66 MCL' GTR, but...

I will guarantee you that it is neither GTR #07R or GTR #11R which are the two GTRs we have already confirmed as being refitted to appear like the LM. This is in fact a third GTR which has received a similar treatment being painted Orange. I

Such a shame, I think, to infringe so closely on the look of the LM, but still so beautiful.

>8^)
ER

I was pretty sure it was 07R...why do you say it's not?

The license plates--now that I think about it, McLaren factory registrations seem to be the best bet... no idea who would be behind the wheel.

#07R has different side skirts and a different rear wing. It also doesn't have the same flared front wheel arch as this car, nor does it have the tacked on fender lips in the rear. One last variation is that on #07R, the inset area of the rear bumper where the exhaust sticks out is black and on this mystery car it is painted orange like the rest of the car. It's all in the details really.

Now, all those differences I just pointed out are actually an exact match with GTR #11R, however #11R has the additional roof scoop extension that this car seen in Monaco does not. Maybe it flew off at high speed like Selldorff's headlight covers... ;) ...but really I think we are looking at a different car. It would most definitely be a '96 GTR like #11R in any case.

>8^)
ER

well according to Ray Bellm there are only 4 converted GTRs in the world. We've ruled out two and we can also rule out Bellm's car cos it's white and blue. That leaves only one car. 9 GTRs were built in '96 and 11R and 16R (Bellm's car) are accounted for. we are also fairly certain that the Lark cars have not been converted or we would have heard more about them. That rules out 13R and 14R. I think 18R was just for spare parts and didn't have an engine, so it unlikely (but not impossible) for it to be this one. That leaves the old development car, 10R, and 12R, 15R and 17R. Can anybody account for these cars?

#10R is Nick Mason's - it's the red '96 development car. His is also converted for use on the street. Now I have never seen a plate on #11R, but I have on #07R, #10R and #16R so maybe #11R isn't included on Bellm's list of 4. Who really knows...

>8^)
ER

Nick Mason's car was used by EVO for their comparison against the Edonis that was called "Zoom Zoom". The plates are "K40 MCL". In case any of you haven't seen the pics, here they are:
Front 3/4 (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/picture_library/dir_12/car_portal_pic_6337.jpg?2252)
Front 3/4 - driving (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/picture_library/dir_12/car_portal_pic_6338.jpg?1717)
Rear (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/picture_library/dir_12/car_portal_pic_6339.jpg?7994)
"This much is clear when a transporter pulls up and disgorges the only McLaren we could lay our hands on. It's not a regular model but even more special - Nick Mason's GTR, the one and only road-registered example of the F1 that McLaren successfully developed for Le Mans. Much of its carbonfibre is laid bare in the cabin, there's an FIA-approved roll cage and only two seats, the right-hand passenger area being full of electronics and switchgear, but just as on the road car, the finish is exquisite everywhere you look. And when it fires up, well, the sound is simply glorious; even at its fast warm-up idle, the 6.1-litre, normally aspirated V12's note is fantastically complex yet tight, confident and cultured. You know you're in the presence of huge power." - EVO magazine

i thought one of the gulf cars #12R was also licensed for street use, this is its license plate:
N753 HRV

another thing, #11R has also awkward headlight covers, or bulbs to explane it better

I thought there were 4 GTRs converted for road use, that is according to the for sale ad for #16R on qv500.com

There could be a difference between what is considered by some to be roadworthy enough to wear a license plate, and which cars have actually been converted for road use. Also, since the GTRs were road car based, they already have most of the necessary requirements for lights and signals that would be required for registration in many parts of the world.

I know of someone here with a Jaguar XJ220S who has been known to slap a California 'dealer' plate on it and take it for a drive. There's really nothing to stop him unless something bad happened while he was driving it, but that is the risk he chooses to take. The same might be true for some of the GTRs we have seen with license plates as well.

I remembered that Gulf car you referred to as I was making my post, but didn't feel like tracking down the info to include in my post. Maybe those are the four cars (#07R, #10R, #12R, #16R) that were referred to in the QV500.com ad, but that still leaves out the mystery GTR from Monaco which was also wearing a plate and is none of the four cars I just listed.

>8^)
ER

i assume u mean this car?

http://speed.supercars.net/boardpics/2003-9-19/1600552-mini%20magica.jpg

http://speed.supercars.net/boardpics/2003-9-19/1600552-mini%20magicb.jpg

http://speed.supercars.net/boardpics/2003-9-19/1600552-mini%20magicc.jpg

Well that leaves 15R, 17R and perhaps 18R, although that is unlikely. 15R was a Gulf car and 17R was a team bigazzi car. So, anybody know anything about these cars? We're getting close.

i saw 17R a few weeks ago, bmw use it as a promo car, that is not the one you are looking for, TRUST ME, i have seen it twice, and its in the US.

got any photos of it?

EDIT: you're quite right. if anybody else wants confirmation on 17R check out this thread:

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/t90574.html

That leaves only 15R (and maybe 18R). We're almost there!

18R could be one of the hollywood cars that campaigned in brazil? (that is purely speculation)

#18R was one of the Hollywood cars. We were just talking about it the other day and I suggested that Nelson Piquet might have kept it for himself after those two races. tvrfreak stated he believes the car is still in South America.

>8^)
ER

cool, so my guess was right. Do u know offhand which # 18R wore under hollywood livery?

One wore race #01 and the other wore race #09 - I'll have to look when I get home to be certain which was which.

>8^)
ER

ok, thanks. which was the chassis # of the other hollywood car?

Well by process of elimination that makes it 15R, unless of course someone knows something about 15R. Anyway, that's good work. Straight on to R66 MCL then?

I'm sorry, but this process of elimination thing can be good, but there are still too many variables to be certain the Monaco GTR is indeed #15R in my mind. There is no guarantee that both LARK GTRs are still in Japan. There's no guarantee that #18R is still in South America, just the suggestion. There's also the possibility this could be one of the '95 GTRs that received the '96 updates, which are currently unaccounted for. I'd like to believe that it's #15R and put it to rest, but I don't think it's going to be that easy.

I have another angle on getting some info about this car, so I'll let you know if I get a response.

>8^)
ER

i was thinking the same, that was too easy, there have to be other options.

cool, so my guess was right. Do u know offhand which # 18R wore under hollywood livery?

I looked it up - #18R wore the race #01. The other Hollywood-liveried GTR was #11R and it wore #9.

>8^)
ER

thanks a lot



EDIT ( :grinno: ) : Sorry to ask you another favor, but do u know the chassis #'s of the 2 97 Fina GTR's that wore #'s 8 and 9? Thanks

never seen that livery
cna you please post one (or more :D) pics..?
tnx

the hollwood one or the fina #8 and 9 one?

hollywood cars:

http://speed.supercars.net/boardpics/2003-9-21/1607952-mini%20magica.jpg

http://speed.supercars.net/boardpics/2003-9-21/1607952-mini%20magicb.jpg

http://speed.supercars.net/boardpics/2003-9-21/1607952-mini%20magicac.jpg


One of the fina cars i am wondering about:

http://speed.supercars.net/boardpics/2003-9-21/1607937-mini%20magica.jpg