GSR or CR-V????


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S|L3NoZ
08-02-2003, 02:00 PM
Hello guys!!!! I recently bought an Acura Integra RS 95 and I want to swap the engine. I plan to put a turbo, headers, bigger injectors, bigger fuel pump, intercooler, etc.... In fact, I wanna get the more power I can (torque & max speed). But now the problem is that I don't know which is the best block to start with. Can you guys help me!?!? Any other comments you have will be appreciate..... Thx a lot :smile:

Dave

Thepeug
08-02-2003, 02:40 PM
Check out the link at the top of the 92+ civic forum. There's a whole enigne swapping guide that helped me a lot. I'd say go with the CR-V, though. It's got a lot more torque, and would be a good option for turbo.

94tegRS
08-02-2003, 08:41 PM
well if you are gonna turbo, you wont get a header, you gotta get a turbo manifolod. and if you are going to turbo, Id go B20, cheaper and should handle plenty of boost stock, plus big displacement for more torque.

S|L3NoZ
08-03-2003, 01:49 AM
I don't wanna find myself behind.....I wanna be real fast.....

94tegRS
08-03-2003, 01:57 AM
I think that a B20 with turbo cams, and about 15 psi will be fast enough for ya.

S|L3NoZ
08-03-2003, 11:48 PM
Another question.....Should I go with a Type-R, Si-R or Gs-R head....??? Some people told me that if I want max speed, I should go with Type-R. What do you think about it?

chechin
08-03-2003, 11:53 PM
I think if you wanna go turbo you should keep your LS head and block because you need low CR when you use turbo so an LS stock is great, and use your stock tranny, longer gear ratios are the best on turbo charged engines.

S|L3NoZ
08-05-2003, 06:17 PM
Well....I'll probably go with CR-V block....thx guys

94tegRS
08-05-2003, 06:37 PM
yeah, the B20 will bolt up to the LS tranny you got now which is good for turbo app.s, plus the B20 is the same thing as the B18 except the bore, and cr, which is a bit lower. 8.8:1 and the B18 is 9.2:1, I think if you wanna boost any more than about 12 psi, you should get some strong rods, and some (ductile iron?) sleeves. but if you are going to go turbo, you should just spend the moeny that would go towards, head, manifold, vtec wiring, ecu, and all that good stuff on just building a turbo B20. but if you want all motor then go CRVTEC and get some high cr pistons.

S|L3NoZ
08-05-2003, 09:11 PM
Can you tell me what is CRVTECH???? I use to see this term often but never knew what it means.....:confused:

Xtreme Illusions
08-05-2003, 09:36 PM
Its a CRV block with a VTEC head, makes for a high reving high torque engine.

chechin
08-05-2003, 09:38 PM
Originally posted by S|L3NoZ
Can you tell me what is CRVTECH???? I use to see this term often but never knew what it means.....:confused:

that's the setup that uses a B20 CRV Block with a B18 or B16 Vtec Head
:bigthumb:

94tegRS
08-06-2003, 01:39 AM
It can be a high revving/high torque engine, but mostly just high torque, cuz the block cant really be revved all that high. I am use the stock integra redline for street racing at and the track Ill use the redline of a GSR since Ill have a P72 ECU, so Ill shift at like 8200 or so, but you dont wanna rev the B20 very high all the time. poor r/s ratio and no piston squirters.

eckoman_pdx
08-06-2003, 05:55 AM
For a turbo app, defiantly the B20 CRV over a GSR B18C1. But can I ask, since you have a B18B1 LS to begin with, why spend money to junk it for a CRV's B20? The LS is a GREAT GREAT engine to turbo. Arguably one of the best to turbo. You already have the LS tranny, which is perfact for a turbo app due to the longer gear ratios, keeping the turbo spooled longer. Also, a B18B1 can take 12psi on stock internals. It's a very strong engine, with a strong block. The Comperssion Ratio is low enough too, at 9.2:1, so you are fine with that. Why spend money to dump the LS and put in a B20, put that money into making your's an LS turbo. At 12 psi, intercooler, You should be looking as 250 hp or so, and that should be plenty fast for you to start. If you need more, strenghten the internals, close the deck, increase fuel flow, etc, and turn up thr boost. The LS is the engine of choice for many people when wanting to build a turbo'd engine. If you didn't have one, If you had a Civic DX with a D15B7 lets say, I'd say look into the B20 if you want to. But you already are starting with a perfect turbo motor, the LS. Why spend money to swap in the B20 when your current motor is a great turbo motor. That's just money you could have put towards the turbo itself. If you do get the B20, I know that putting in LS cams puts out a little more power. There's a guy in jacksonville with a 12 second turbo'd crv, he put in LS cams. Don't kid yourself though, a Turbo'd LS can be a VERY fast motor.

Also, the CR-Vtec is the same idea as an LSVtec. A B series Vtec head (usually a B16A or B18C1 head) matted to the CRV or the LS Block.

S|L3NoZ
08-06-2003, 12:37 PM
According to your help......I'll probably go with LS or CR-V block. What I want is to get the best performance I can from these blocks. So.....If I go with turbo LS block, will I get better performance than a turbo CR-V? Sorry if I ask so much questions but I really wanna make sure my investments will worth it. 'Cause I would really be disapointed to go with an LS for exemple, and to figure out that the CR-V was better. It's difficult to make a choice 'cause every single person has its opinion about this but, technicaly, there are evidences that can't be denied and I'm looking for those evidences. It appears that the GS-R isn't the best over all so.....let's forget about this one. CR-V seems to be the best for torque but that's all I know. Is it reliable? What about max speed? LS is a stranger to me......:confused:Thx again for helping me out guys:smile:

eckoman_pdx
08-07-2003, 06:21 AM
Max speed, etc, is all dependant on your driving ability (1/4 mile) and how you tune the engine. The LS can be a very very powerful engine, well over 400 HP properly built. A CR-V can be quick and powerful too. Here's a post I made a few days ago, but it should help you see what it possible with a LS. For the record, the turbo'd CR-V civic in jacksonville is 297 HP and 12.7 or 12.9 seconds. A LS can be equally as powerfull. Built properly, you can even break this 300 hp barrier. Here is some info of a 500 HP LS. Robbie Potts in San Deigo has a 500 HP Turbo'd LS-VTec integra (he has a full interior, nothing stripped). He built it himself, including the turbo system and all. He did it over 3 years ago too, way before the masses had discovered the LS-Vtec and CR-VTec. It is still running. Thats a 500HP LS-VTec Turbo (B16A head, LS block) He did some very creative things. He built the Turbo manifold himself using a pulse width thoery based on firing order to further help spool his turbo (turbonetics turbo, 60-1 compressor with a stage 5 exhaust wheel and 78 a/r housing, spearco intercooler). He uses a Federal Mogul Speed Pro stand alone fuel computer and 1,000 cc injectors, a setup that was used by Lisa Kubo and Papadakis. Since you generally generate more power if the wastegate dumps straight into the atmosphere, but it's very loud. He did it anyway, but silenced it using a 4-stroke Yoshimura motorcycle exhaust. Of course, he also rebuilt the internals for massive boost, etc . You can hit 500 HP if you build the motor right and provide the proper fuel dilivery system and fuel managment unit. Make sure you close the deck. On a side note, Jason Whitfeild, owner of Rage performance in cali has a 725 HP turbo'd 96 H22 civic hatch. It's street legal. Remember, you can make both the CR-V and the LS extremely fast and very powerful. It's all in how you build it as a whole package. Make sure you plan it out properly and contuine doing research before you start.

94tegRS
08-07-2003, 02:17 PM
Im sure you could get more than 297 out of a turbo B20. I saw a dyno of 274 from a NA CRVTEC.Im pretty sure it was on importbuilders.com but just went to look for it and the sites completeley different and I cant find it.

civicuser
08-07-2003, 03:25 PM
which swap would be better for nitrous oxide? Im looking into that because i dont want spend $2,000 for a turbo, but i still want more power, so I thought zex was the way to go. but hey if you can find a turbo for around $500-$1000 tell me cuz i want to know

:sly:

eckoman_pdx
08-07-2003, 04:55 PM
How much of a shot of Nitrious Oxide are you looking for? Because IMO, I would recommend a Turbo waaayyyyy before Nitrious. For Nitrious, I don't think you should go above a 35 shot. There are some computerized system's which shut off if the nitriuos/fuel amount it too much, but for that price, I'd save up the rest for a turbo.

S|L3NoZ
08-08-2003, 01:17 AM
Nitrous........don't worth it for the money........turbo last longer for better result.......

S|L3NoZ
08-08-2003, 01:20 AM
Which turbo would you suggest me???? I heard a lot of good comments about Garrett......Anything better?????

civicuser
08-08-2003, 02:02 AM
can someone tell me where i can find a turbo for under $1000 because i dont want to spend a buttload of money on an expensive turbo, where as i can get zex for about $500

94tegRS
08-08-2003, 02:05 AM
you cant get a turbo for under 1k, if you do your lucky, you need the turbo, the manifold, the downpipe, the extra fuel, the piping, the oil lines, the BOV, the wastegate.

civicuser
08-08-2003, 02:10 AM
im just not up to saving $2000. im going to college in a couple years and i wont have time to street race as much as i want to. all that money will go to waste.

94tegRS
08-08-2003, 03:20 AM
naw, the turbo will still be there when you get out of school, and it will be more fun to drive while in college anyways. and 2k is actually cutting it close to get all new. mine for my ZC is just gonna be like 500 bucks though, cuz I already got the turbo froma friend, manifold is gonna cost me 20 bucks for the plate steel, tubes are free and friends making it, downpipe and piping are cost of materials as well, the IC is 40 bucks off a saab. the oil lines probably like 50 bucks, then theres the FMU for 100 and the missing link for 40. the BOV is 75.

instead of the missing link/fmu I might just get the SAFC.

but its reccomended to have a used turbo rebuilt but mine spins good and has no shaft play at all so im just gonna hope for the best

eckoman_pdx
08-08-2003, 10:10 PM
Beofre we can recommned you a good turbo, there are a few things we need to know.
1)what is the Max HP output you are looking to achive
2)what is the engine you are starting with, and what is the HP

After this is know, you can figure out how much Bosst is required to achive the desired HP level. Then you can look at different turbo's and see what suits your needs. Someone looking to make 400HP, for exampel, will need a different Turbo that someone looking to make 210HP.

S|L3NoZ
08-11-2003, 12:48 PM
I'd like to reach 300HP and over depending on the cost and I'll probably start with an LS. But I'm hesitating between LS and CRV so.....give me info on those 2. Thx :smile:

Ricochet
08-11-2003, 02:50 PM
Originally posted by S|L3NoZ
I plan to put a turbo, headers, etc....
Dude quit wasting our time. You don't even know what you're talking about.

S|L3NoZ
08-11-2003, 06:13 PM
hey.......if you find that you waste your time answering this post......well you just gotta leave this topic.......no one is forcing you here so...... stop being such an ass :thefinger I'm newb in the world of tuning......I wanna learn just like anybody else who begins......The more informations I gather will make me understand things i didn't know before.......Did anybody here complains about me asking questions??? A forum is a way to learn new stuff from other's experiences.......You don't seem to know that when I wrote "I plan to put turbo, headers....etc" I was just giving an exemple to show i wanted to tune my engine to make it more powerful.....

Thepeug
08-11-2003, 06:29 PM
Haha, I understand man. I made the same mistake. A turbo doesn't have headers. Exhaust gases go straight to the turbine, then to the downpipe, cat, exhaust. On a non-turbo car, it'd go headers, cat, exhaust.

S|L3NoZ
08-11-2003, 06:31 PM
Yeah......:tongue: But.....Somebody told me so and now I know that headers dont go with turbo.....:wink: Beginner's mistakes :biggrin:

eckoman_pdx
08-12-2003, 05:41 AM
Originally posted by S|L3NoZ
I'd like to reach 300HP and over depending on the cost and I'll probably start with an LS. But I'm hesitating between LS and CRV so.....give me info on those 2. Thx :smile:

Well if 300 hp is your goal, here's some info.
The LS is 142 hp stock. You will need approxamlty (in thoery) 16.3 psi to getth LS to 300 hp. since the n/a air presure in the cylinder is 14.7 psi...doubleing it in thoery doubles the output. You would need 16.3 psi, or a pressure ratio of 2.11, to achive 300 hp. If you are to produce 300 hp with the LS, you will need 30 lbs/air per minute to reach the goal. With these facts, you can start looking for a turbo. Look at the compressor maps, The Horizontal axis is air flow lbs/min. You will want to go to the spot on the map where 30 is located. The go to the vertcial axis, this is the pressure ratio. You will go to the spot where 2.11 is at. Then follow both these out to where they meet on the graph. You want the point the meet at to be in the 73% efficeny island (oval where the 73% efficeny range for the turbo is). If the meet outside of this range,like at 65% for example, it is best to seek a different turbo. I hope this helps out a little bit. I have been quite busy lately, but I will do some research if I can and see what I can pull up if I have time. If you want to start looking on your own, remember, a pressure ratio of 2.11 (16.3psi, 1.11 bar) and you need to flow 30 lbs/min of air for 300hp. Look for the a turbo where the point on the compressor map these two numbers meet falls in the 73% efficeny island. I hope this helps out a little.

S|L3NoZ
08-12-2003, 12:07 PM
Yeah it helped me a lot :biggrin: One thing.....Can anybody tell me some turbo brand name!? There is Garrett.....but that's all I know :confused:

Thepeug
08-12-2003, 08:11 PM
Greddy, Apex'i, Edlebrock, Turbonetics, a bunch of universal turbos. Not much, but that's all I can think of.

eckoman_pdx
08-13-2003, 06:16 AM
Originally posted by S|L3NoZ
Yeah it helped me a lot :biggrin: One thing.....Can anybody tell me some turbo brand name!? There is Garrett.....but that's all I know :confused:

I know Greddy uses Mitsubishi turbochargers in there kits. For example, the turbo they use in the kit for your engine (as well as the GSR) is the Mitsubish TD05H-18G 8cm2 turbo. I am not saying this is the greatest turbo to use, just saying Mitsubishi is the turbo brand greddy uses.
XS-engineering uses there own turbo, I do belive. I could be wrong.

Other manufactorers of Turbos (that I know of for sure) include Garrett, as you know, and Turbonetics.
Most pre-made turbo kit you buy seem to use either a Mitsubishi turbo, Garrett, or Turbonetics turbo.

S|L3NoZ
08-13-2003, 08:59 PM
The only compressor maps I found was on turbonetics.com.... I found the turbo that was 2.11 pressure ratio, 30 lbs/min and 73% effiency. On turbonetics.com, if I read the compressor map properly, it would be the TO4B V1/V2. Notice me if I'm wrong......I'd like to know which company you guys think is the best if you have any idea about it. I have planty of questions. I'll probably start another topic for this but before, I'll try to make my decision on a turbo on this topic. Thx a lot eckoman_pdx and Thepeug :biggrin:

eckoman_pdx
08-16-2003, 03:20 AM
The only compressor maps I found was on turbonetics.com.... I found the turbo that was 2.11 pressure ratio, 30 lbs/min and 73% effiency. On turbonetics.com, if I read the compressor map properly, it would be the TO4B V1/V2. Notice me if I'm wrong......I'd like to know which company you guys think is the best if you have any idea about it. I have planty of questions. I'll probably start another topic for this but before, I'll try to make my decision on a turbo on this topic. Thx a lot eckoman_pdx and Thepeug :biggrin:

Turbonnetics is a perfectly reputable company. They make good turbo's. If you want to check out other companies, you might have to call and find out how you can see the compressor maps. I know Garrett makes good turbo's too. You'll be fine with either of those 2 companies. Turbonetcs, Garrett, they in general produce good turbos. Those 2 companies would be fine choices. HKS may make their own turbos, but I am not sure, so yoiu'll have to check. Also, don't forget the Turbo timer. A boost controller is obivous (manual oor electronics, which I perfer). But don't foret that turbo timers. It will help save your turbo, allowing for proper cool down after driving.

S|L3NoZ
08-16-2003, 07:06 PM
Is there any other modifications I could do on my turbo B18B1 to make it more powerful and reliable??? Like rods, pistons,crankshaft,etc. Another question I didn't get any response to, which head should I go with??? Some told me to go with stock LS head but I'd like to go with DOHC instead of SOHC. I got some much questions that I'm scared to miss something when building the engine :confused:

eckoman_pdx
08-16-2003, 11:12 PM
Is there any other modifications I could do on my turbo B18B1 to make it more powerful and reliable??? Like rods, pistons,crankshaft,etc. Another question I didn't get any response to, which head should I go with??? Some told me to go with stock LS head but I'd like to go with DOHC instead of SOHC. I got some much questions that I'm scared to miss something when building the engine :confused:

The LS head IS DOHC...it's just non-vtec. The LS is a B18B1 (94+) or B18A1 (90-93). The LS is a 1834 cc (1.8 liter) 4 cylinder, 16 vavle DOHC motor. All B series motors are DOHC. So yes, go with the LS head, it's fine. Whoever told you the LS is SOHC don't have a clue what they are saying, cuz the LS is DOHC. The only reason people take the LS head off is they want an LS-Vtec motor, so they put on a VTEC B16A or GSR head... but thats more of a N/a motor build in general. For forced induction, the stock LS head is great. The LS/Vtec will allow for a greater base HP..so more at the same boost, but for turbo, vtec cams high lift can cause spooling problems for the turbo at high rpm's. Also, you shouldn't rev the LS block much above 7K until you plan to re-build the motor to handle high 8000 plus rpm revs. For a Turbo, stick with the LS head, it IS DOHC. I have a a 97 B18B1 in my civic. as I said....LS = non-vtec DOHC head. Also, in general, any mods you do to the engine (not CAI or exhaust) to make extra HP before turbo, will rersult in a higher boost'd HP in the end. For rods and pistons, you are putting in low c/r pistons that are stronger with stronger rods...and closing the deck, stronger internals all around....valves, springs, etc...to allow the motor to be able to handle boost above 12 psi the LS can take in stock from. This will allow the motor to be able to handle more power, which= more boost, making it more reliable at this boost as well. Although most ppl do not recomend doing an LS/Vtec turbo (me included), if done and built properly, it can create one hell of an engine, and reliabel too. I know of someone who did all the work and built it themselves (they have there own machine shop and an engineering degree) who has a 500 HP boosted LS/Vtec. Of course, they did it correctly, so it works. It was very important to get the correct FMU and injectors, fuel pump as well. But don't over-rev it becuase it has vtec all of a sudden. The main problems with LS/Vtec's is people would really can't build them do, and the bad build don't last, plus the person over-rev's the motor to like 8K cuz they suddenly have vtec.

S|L3NoZ
08-17-2003, 02:14 AM
My father has his own machine shop......I'm the boss's son so......you know what it means :smile: I can do whatever I want for free...... :wink:

eckoman_pdx
08-17-2003, 06:26 AM
My father has his own machine shop......I'm the boss's son so......you know what it means :smile: I can do whatever I want for free...... :wink:
That would be nice to have...free access to a machine shop:D Machine work on the block would be much cheaper, lol. So would closing the deck, working on the quench area, etc. Ahh, that would be very nice to have. It certainly would save costs. That's cool that your father has hs own machine shop, so you can get machine work done free.

S|L3NoZ
08-17-2003, 04:53 PM
What does C/R means and CAI :confused:

S|L3NoZ
08-17-2003, 06:22 PM
I'll try to gather as much informations as I can to do machine works by myself on my engine to make it real fast and powerful. With all the infos you gave me eckoman_pdx, I'm beginning to understand stuff that will really help me. Any infos you have to give me will be appreciate. I'm from Quebec and I don't know a lot of people with experiences that can really help me. Most people here makes modifications on the exterior of their car to attract girls and 'coz their car looks good, they say that it is the fastest of all. You probably know what I mean. Serious tuner like me are rare over here,that's why I need to go on forum like this one to learn about REAL tuning. Continue your great work :smile:

eckoman_pdx
08-18-2003, 01:14 AM
I'll try to gather as much informations as I can to do machine works by myself on my engine to make it real fast and powerful. With all the infos you gave me eckoman_pdx, I'm beginning to understand stuff that will really help me. Any infos you have to give me will be appreciate. I'm from Quebec and I don't know a lot of people with experiences that can really help me. Most people here makes modifications on the exterior of their car to attract girls and 'coz their car looks good, they say that it is the fastest of all. You probably know what I mean. Serious tuner like me are rare over here,that's why I need to go on forum like this one to learn about REAL tuning. Continue your great work :smile:

I know exactly what you mean about slappin on a body kit and thinkin yur car's fast as hell, lol. I call it VHP, or Visual Horsepower. :iceslolan Also, C/R= Comperssion Ratio, CAI = Cold Air Intake.

S|L3NoZ
08-18-2003, 12:46 PM
How do I know which size of injectors will be necessary for my turbo setup??? Another question.....How did you know what type of turbo was necessary to achieve 300HP??? I'd like to know how because if I decide to make 350-400HP for exemple, I'd like to be able to find the good size by myself. Thx :)

boosted331
08-18-2003, 03:36 PM
Turbonnetics is a perfectly reputable company. They make good turbo's.


Turdbonetics is the biggest farce ever. Shitty customer service, shitty prices, shitty products, they're a crap company. Never going to get any business of mine ever again. If you want a turbo go to precision turbo, or innovative. HKS turbos are just garrett parts matched together, mostly of off the shelf parts. Only reason I'd buy an HKS turbo is some of the stuff they get is direct from garrett of japan or garrett of australia, which makes it very hard to get in north america (look at the incon fiasco, garrett's 3037 BB turbos were on backorder to N/A for a year) He doesn't really need a boost controller either, ANY standalone can control boost more accurately than a manual or electric, and lets you datalog.

If you want a turbo, call up laskey racing and ask for art. He is the god of turbos, they're a PTE dealer and he will set you up with the proper turbo for your app. Make sure he puts magic touch on your turbo :) 817-243-2509

S|L3NoZ
08-18-2003, 06:40 PM
The problem is that I'm in Quebec and the manufacturer you're talking about is probably in the US..... :( But maybe I can call for suggestions or anything like that.....

eckoman_pdx
08-19-2003, 01:44 AM
Turdbonetics is the biggest farce ever. Shitty customer service, shitty prices, shitty products, they're a crap company. Never going to get any business of mine ever again. If you want a turbo go to precision turbo, or innovative. HKS turbos are just garrett parts matched together, mostly of off the shelf parts. Only reason I'd buy an HKS turbo is some of the stuff they get is direct from garrett of japan or garrett of australia, which makes it very hard to get in north america (look at the incon fiasco, garrett's 3037 BB turbos were on backorder to N/A for a year) He doesn't really need a boost controller either, ANY standalone can control boost more accurately than a manual or electric, and lets you datalog.

If you want a turbo, call up laskey racing and ask for art. He is the god of turbos, they're a PTE dealer and he will set you up with the proper turbo for your app. Make sure he puts magic touch on your turbo :) 817-243-2509


For the record, I am NOT staying you are wrong. I saying I know people who have bought turbonetics turbo's and got a good turbo and been happy. Of course, they have NEVER had to deal with custmer service. It's most lilkely like the Jackson Racing arguement. A few people got a bad supercharger, got horrible customer serive and then some people started claiming Jackson Racing sucked ass and was awful. That doesn't make them awful, that makes customer serive when you have trouble awful. Then again, I know of someone who had an AWFUL experience from JG Engine Dynamics. That Doesn't make them bad, so he got bad luck and screwed. JG knows their shit, and for the most part are very good. But it's something to keep an eye out for, definatly. I think the same goes for turbonetics. They arn't nessarly shitty, but shitty customer service "as you told me about" doesn't make them all great either. They are reputable, as in they have a good reputation with plenty of people. That being said, that by no means makes them the greatest company on earth. I know of plenty of people who like Turbonetics and by no means think it is shitty, and plenty who swear by Garrett. Just make sure to research what you get, Every company has complants of some sort. As for boost controller, I ment something like the Greddy Profec-B, or better yet the E-Manage, which does more than just control boost. I suppose I should have said that.

eckoman_pdx
08-19-2003, 01:48 AM
The problem is that I'm in Quebec and the manufacturer you're talking about is probably in the US..... :( But maybe I can call for suggestions or anything like that.....

If you are going to call into the US, call Performance LAB in Kirkland, WA and ask for Tim Anderson. That guy knows his shit, and could definatly help you find whats best for you/what you need. Tim will put it toghter correct.
1-425-820-7488
www.performance-lab.com

LSCRX
08-23-2003, 10:22 PM
I did some research befor i built my car. Like you, i was looking into turbo. I decided to go ls because i want to build an all motor car, but back to you. Since your dad has a machine shop it should be pretty damn easy to do. Take the CRV block, install the b18 crank, rods, and pistons on stock parts you should be able to boost about 20psi. The b18 has a shotrer stroke so it revs faster and higher than the stokc b20. Also if you use tha b16a head it has a lower c/r that the b20 head so you can squeez a little more boost out of it. Ive heard the CRV-TECH is kinda of a tricky swap. You have to run oil lines and do some machine work to the block. As far as cams, crower.com has some cams thats for turbo apps.

boosted331
08-23-2003, 11:12 PM
I did some research befor i built my car. Like you, i was looking into turbo. I decided to go ls because i want to build an all motor car, but back to you. Since your dad has a machine shop it should be pretty damn easy to do. Take the CRV block, install the b18 crank, rods, and pistons on stock parts you should be able to boost about 20psi. The b18 has a shotrer stroke so it revs faster and higher than the stokc b20. Also if you use tha b16a head it has a lower c/r that the b20 head so you can squeez a little more boost out of it. Ive heard the CRV-TECH is kinda of a tricky swap. You have to run oil lines and do some machine work to the block. As far as cams, crower.com has some cams thats for turbo apps.

Hey guess what, you can't install LS pistons into a CRV block. And replacing CRV crank with LS crank would be quite dumb, considering they are the exact same crank, they're the same part number. B16 head on a b20 block will NOT lower the compression ratio. B20/B18B head = 45CC chambers B16/ITR head = 42.7CC chambers.

eckoman_pdx
08-24-2003, 01:16 AM
I did some research befor i built my car. Like you, i was looking into turbo. I decided to go ls because i want to build an all motor car, but back to you. Since your dad has a machine shop it should be pretty damn easy to do. Take the CRV block, install the b18 crank, rods, and pistons on stock parts you should be able to boost about 20psi. The b18 has a shotrer stroke so it revs faster and higher than the stokc b20. Also if you use tha b16a head it has a lower c/r that the b20 head so you can squeez a little more boost out of it. Ive heard the CRV-TECH is kinda of a tricky swap. You have to run oil lines and do some machine work to the block. As far as cams, crower.com has some cams thats for turbo apps.

First off, it's spelled CR-Vtec.....NOT CRV-TECH. Remember, VTECH = A company that makes phones, Vtec = Variable Valve Timing Electronic Lift Control, a technology Honda incorporates into many of their Motors. There is a difference there. Remember, It's VTEC....NOT VTECH!!
Okay, secondly, When you put a Vtec head on the B20 Block, there isn't a lot of piston to vavle clearence. The Vtec heads have larger 33mm Intake valves vs the B20's 31 mm vavles. When Dyno tuning, contact will occur between the pistons and vavles if the cam is advanced much more than 4 degree's. It's adviceable to not advance the timing of the Intake Cam at all. Also, with the B20's, the B20B (97-98 CRV) is the low compression one (8.8:1). The B20Z (99-01 CRV) has a much higher c/r (I've seen both 9.6:1 for the JDM SMX and 10.2:1 for the 99+CRV listed). I won't mention anything else, as boosted331 covered some other problems. Also, with cams, if you run larger lift and duration aftermark cams on a CR-Vtec, this piston's vavle pockets should be modified and the piston to vavle clearence checked before the head is final and attached onto the block. Now, as for boosting a CR-Vtec, the B20 sleeves have been know to crack under the high compression caused by boost. If you think you are going to run 20psi on stock B20 sleeves, you are going to have nasty cracks and a messed up block. Now re-sleeve it and close the deck, and your good to go with that. But to say change out pistons, rods, crank, and you can get 20psi is nuts. There is NO WAY IN HELL the B20 sleeves will hold up under 20psi of boost...period. The LS block can handle more boost stock than the CRV block (the LS can handle 12psi on stock internals, more than the other motors, where 8psi is usually the limit). Even then, NO HONDA BLOCK can handle 20psi stock, end of story. Even with the pistons and rods swapped out. If you want to run 20psi, you have to re-sleeve the block and/or close the deck. Running 20psi without doing that is pure engine suicide, especially where the sleeve are concerned. You'll have one mess of a motor by the time you are done, and will be having to spend a hell of a lot more money than doing it right to begin with.

S|L3NoZ
08-24-2003, 10:33 AM
I have some problems with technical facts......First of all, I don't know what is the internals and closing the deck..... :banghead: I'm french and I don't know what this is. I'm bilingual but when it comes to some mechanical terms, I'm lost :confused: Another thing......I wanna make my engine 300 or 400HP but I don't wanna bring my engine somewhere and tell "Make this engine a 400HP" :headshake I wanna know and understand the steps to achieve my goal. If you know a website that explain all of this or anything else, plz tell me. I got a lot of help on this topic and I wanna thank you for it but still I need more knowledge.

jcrx
08-24-2003, 01:15 PM
I have some problems with technical facts......First of all, I don't know what is the internals and closing the deck..... :banghead: I'm french and I don't know what this is. I'm bilingual but when it comes to some mechanical terms, I'm lost :confused: Another thing......I wanna make my engine 300 or 400HP but I don't wanna bring my engine somewhere and tell "Make this engine a 400HP" :headshake I wanna know and understand the steps to achieve my goal. If you know a website that explain all of this or anything else, plz tell me. I got a lot of help on this topic and I wanna thank you for it but still I need more knowledge.
http://www.forum-auto.com/sqlforum/section1/sujet8289-7385.htm
http://esprit.vtec.free.fr/page_liens.htm

Heres a couple site in french that may be a little easier to understand. I don't understand them, but I don't speak french. The first one is a board like this.

S|L3NoZ
08-24-2003, 01:42 PM
Thx for those 2 links but I'm french from Quebec and I hate the way Europeen French speaks :biggrin: Don't suggest me french websites, I prefer english :)

jcrx
08-24-2003, 02:29 PM
Thx for those 2 links but I'm french from Quebec and I hate the way Europeen French speaks :biggrin: Don't suggest me french websites, I prefer english :)
Well sorry, but if you are having trouble understanding some very important terms, maybe you should also talk about them in your first language. I understand your pain, I am in Germany, and it took me for ever to get a guy to understand what a LSD was. Selbstsperrdifferential, yea ok, I was going to figure that one out.

eckoman_pdx
08-26-2003, 02:32 AM
Okay, I'll quickly explain what "closing the deck" is. Have you seen the inside of a honda motor? how surrounding the cylinder walls is.....a space of air between the outside cylinder walls and the rest of the block. It's not connected there? That is an open deck design. A lot a motors ment for heavy boost are of a closed deck design, that space of air isn't there. The outter cylinder walls connect to the block right there, no space. It's "closed" instead, directly conncting. This is a closed deck design. The closed deck = more reinforcement, more stable, it allows more boost as a result.A lot of the turbocharged Nissan engines have a closed deck design. You can run boost levels on a closed deck design that generally harm open deck design, especially when you consider then open deck design on a honda was not design with a turbocharger in mind. Re-Sleeving, is where you put in new sleeves, with thicker walls, to allow more stablitiy during forced induction apps. You can re-sleeve and still have an open deck design. What you are doing is not closing the deck, but bacially making the cylinder walls thicker. Then, some people do both. I persoanllyl feel safer closing the deck, vs just resleeving. I've seen some bad jobs re-sleeving.

The Internals, okay...this refers to....suprise...the internal componets of the motor. Replacing the Connecting Rods with new, stronger ones. Putting in stronger pistons (lower comprssion ratio for forced induction apps). The Vavles, springs, etc...put in new, stronger components there too. Thes are examples of replacing the internals. The Stock Honda Crankshaft should do you fine, so don't worry about that. Then you can also port and polish the head, the intake and exhaust ports to improve airflow. Better airflow = more HP. Also, a 3 or 5 anlge vavle job does also helps. I hope these examples help explain some of the terms I have been using a little bit.

94tegRS
08-26-2003, 03:14 AM
ok, I knew mokst of the terms, and I have a block gaurd, that will : close the deck" correct?

and about the 5 angle valve job, what exactly do they do when you have a shop do this for you??

S|L3NoZ
08-26-2003, 05:41 PM
Damn great!! :biggrin: These exemples were perfect to make me understand!! But how do I close the deck!?!? Probably parts they sell in stores....if not,how? And for the valves angle....I heard that 5 was the best.....can I do that by myself in my machine shop?? And there's probably something I should know to make it properly....

S|L3NoZ
08-26-2003, 06:02 PM
I'll try to build my forced induction B18B1 with VTEC....you told me that to do so, you had to build the engine properly....I'll gather the necessary infos to do so....My plans are 300 or 400HP depending on my money....There's a lot of stuff i can do by myself....port & polish, evrything that requires machine shop work....The big deal will be bying the parts, knowing what to do and doing the proper mods so it won't screw up :uhoh: evrytime you guys give me good infos, i have a note book and I write it down....I'm really serious about doing this :smile: I'm not trying to lose your time or anything like that....later on I'll write down on this forum the notes I took so you can tell me if evrything's O.K. Thx guys :biggrin:

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