97 Ranger clutch problem - questions


tempfixit
02-10-2012, 07:47 AM
97 Ranger, 2.3 engine, 5 spd. 175k

Recently purchased knowing clutch problem, no clutch pressure. When starting in gear it will immediately move forward meaning clutch stays engaged. No noises at idle while in neutral, so I suspect that it is either the master clyinder or slave clyinder I have read all the threads on clutch problems. I have not gotten it into shop yet to start investigating. I will check to see if slave has any moisture on it and go from there.

any thoughts welcome.

Secondly looking at the online Oreily's site it shows 2 different applications for the master clyinder. 1 shows line DOR and the other line PTQ. Can anyone tell or show with pics the difference of the two.

PS: I was at Oreily's this morning and asked about the LINE DOR AND PTQ. Line DOR is DORMAN Brand and PTQ is Power Torque brand

Thanks for help

12Ounce
02-11-2012, 11:04 AM
Though I agree with replacing both the master and remote (politically correct!) cylinder ... I suspect the clutch has failed internally, locking the flywheel to the tranmission input shaft. Not a big deal, you want to replace the clutch disc and pressure plate (kit available) anyway. $200 max!

What you may want to add .... removing and machining the flywheel (if you have access to shop that does that work) .... and replacing the rear crank seal (use Ford part).

tempfixit
02-11-2012, 03:59 PM
Though I agree with replacing both the master and remote (politically correct!) cylinder ... I suspect the clutch has failed internally, locking the flywheel to the tranmission input shaft. Not a big deal, you want to replace the clutch disc and pressure plate (kit available) anyway. $200 max!

What you may want to add .... removing and machining the flywheel (if you have access to shop that does that work) .... and replacing the rear crank seal (use Ford part).


Thanks 12Ouonce,

If the clutch plate is locked to the tranny input shaft wouldn't you hear noise from throw out bearing or would you only hear noise if pressure plate fingers or bearing were bad? Hopefully there is a inspection plate I can look thru to see if throw out bearing is moving against pressure plate to stop clutch. ( I have replace clutches before but not vehicle with hydraulic clutch.)

I have obtained quotes from NAPA, Oreily's and Carquest plus looked at the Ford website for local prces on Ford prices. I have also found a seller on Ebay Grip Force which sells clutch parts and advertise not to be China made. Here is a link to the kit for $93.00.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/400266513689?_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649&item=400266513689&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK:MEWAX:IT&vxp=mtr

Has anyone purchased their products??? I need to check into their warranty. (Oreilys clutch waarranty specify that proof of resurfacing flywheel or purchase of new flywheel is required)

If I need to replace clutch and pressure plate I plan on removing flywheel and either resurfacing ($40 @ Carquest) or installing new from (Oreilys @ $59.) If the tranny needs to be removed I plan on also replacing clutch remote (slave) clyinder so I do not need to pull tranny again later.

I will also consider replacing rear crank seal if removing flywheel.

Thanks again 12 Ounce for input.

12Ounce
02-12-2012, 04:22 PM
I am not familiar with those brands... probably OK.

Manual tranmissions are not that heavy. When I was a younger me, I used to remove them totally by hand ... on my back. But the years have me wiser ... and weaker.

Today, I would drop one end of the driveshaft ... remove the shifter (links?) from the tranny ....so it can move backwards. Replace the top two bolts (holding the tranny bell to the block) with some very long bolts ... that become guide-bolts. Remove the remainder of the bolts and slide the tranny back on the guide-bolts. Support the rear of the tranny with a jack-stand.

There should now be enough room for the entire job. Afterwards, the tranny can just slide back into place.

tempfixit
02-12-2012, 07:00 PM
I am not familiar with those brands... probably OK.

Manual tranmissions are not that heavy. When I was a younger me, I used to remove them totally by hand ... on my back. But the years have me wiser ... and weaker.

Today, I would drop one end of the driveshaft ... remove the shifter (links?) from the tranny ....so it can move backwards. Replace the top two bolts (holding the tranny bell to the block) with some very long bolts ... that become guide-bolts. Remove the remainder of the bolts and slide the tranny back on the guide-bolts. Support the rear of the tranny with a jack-stand.

There should now be enough room for the entire job. Afterwards, the tranny can just slide back into place.


Thanks 12Ounce, that is a damn good idea. I will have to remember that.

Here is a link for bleeding clutch system video:

http://www.vxv.com/video/er5AjEhW0kSX/ford-ranger-mazda-b-series-pickup-clutch-hydraulic-release-system-bleeding-procedure-part-2.html

UPDATE: Today we worked on the clutch, followed the procedure in the video. Determined that we had way more than the recomended shaft travel of 1/8th inch so we disconnected the line off of slave clyinder and removed from truck and bleed. Reinstalled line and master clyinder and did the gravity flush like said in video. During the flush air did come out of the slave clyinder bleed valve then fluid finally started to flow, the fluid was black and grudey looking so we flushed almost a small bottle of brake fluid threw it. The fluid was very clean looking when quit flushing. Started vehicle while still in the air and clutched worked great, worked the clutch pedal a number of more times then bleed again just to see if any more debri would come out of slve clyinder. Took for test drive and had no problems. Drove vehicle to home about 7 miles from shop with several stop signs on the way and worked fine. So we will keep a watch on the fluid reservoir and drive. I am thinking that the old fluid was so full of sludge that it was blocking the flow thus creating air pockets that finally rendered the clutch unoperal. Time will tell.

Thanks for all the help and advice and will post again if problems occur again.

EDIT: I would think a person could reverse pressure bleed clutch system, not sure any thoughts about this?? There are links for making a pressure bleeder for under $20, but I was thinnking of getting a 50cc cattle syringe and reverse bleeding that way. ($6)

12Ounce
02-13-2012, 09:43 AM
Good, you got lucky. You replaced nothing but fluid? Very lucky!

If the old fluid was very black, I wonder what that could be but worn rubber material. ?? Could be this stuff plugged some check valve in the master ... causing fluid to "not return".

And it reads as though your model has the external remote ... a better design. On some models you have to separate the tranny from the block to access the remote cylinder.

Good luck with it.

I don't have any experience with the bleeding procedure you outline .... I just use the old "bleed/dump" method. I do find that clutch systems, being so "vertical" in arrangement, tend to self-bleed.

I also use synthetic fluid because the old DOT5 is now rare.

tempfixit
02-13-2012, 01:34 PM
Good, you got lucky. You replaced nothing but fluid? Very lucky!

If the old fluid was very black, I wonder what that could be but worn rubber material. ?? Could be this stuff plugged some check valve in the master ... causing fluid to "not return".

And it reads as though your model has the external remote ... a better design. On some models you have to separate the tranny from the block to access the remote cylinder.

Good luck with it.

I don't have any experience with the bleeding procedure you outline .... I just use the old "bleed/dump" method. I do find that clutch systems, being so "vertical" in arrangement, tend to self-bleed.

I also use synthetic fluid because the old DOT5 is now rare.

I am also a thinking that the black fluid came from the deteriation of the rubber seals, I never have taken a clutch master or remote (slave) clyinder apart but imagine they are on the same confiquration as a brake master clyinder and have the rubber cup seals.

The remote/slave clyinder is inside the tranny and tranny has to be removed to replace, the fluid line from the master clyinder needs to be removed from remote clyinder on the outside of the tranny housing and the bleeding screw is located above the line to bleed system also from outside of housing.

I believe changing the fluid in hydraulic clutch systems should be done just like the brake fluid should be flushed every 2 years or so.

After reading on tthinterneetiitappears that reverse bleeding is done also but you need to flush the old fluid first then reverse blled to make sure air is out of system.

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