Knocking noise and starter issue


jcatalanello
05-17-2011, 08:25 AM
Okay, so over a month ago I went to start up my 99 Windstar for the first time that morning. It turned over, made some clanking racket, and then locked up. Tried to start it again, and it just made a clicking noise, like a solenoid engaging. I kept trying, and it only made that clink noise. I checked the oil, and it was barely on the stick ( i know that was my fault for not checking it for a while). I added the only oil I had, which was less than a quart, and then it's started right up, and has driven like a champ for the last month. This last week however, I went to start it up on morning, and I got that same clink noise, but no clanking racket. I though maybe the battery was just low, and tried jumping it, but still clink. Bought a new (not refurbished) starter, and it still made the clink noise. Checked the oil, and it was fine. Bench tested old starter, and it was fine. But old starter back on, and cleaned all power and ground cables at both ends, and still just a clink. So I ran jump cables to the starter from the battery, so as to bypass all normal cables. Clinked the first try, but then it turned over. But when it turned over, at had this awful, loud, knocking noise that sounded like that one time a month ago but the motor didn't lock up. The knocking followed the RPMs, and seemed to come from around the starter area. We shut it off right away, and spent the next two days messing with the starter, flexplate, and torque converter, and all seemed fine. We did a compression test just to see if perhaps it was in fact the dreaded rod knock. We did for cylinders, and when we pulled the spark plug on the 5th, antifreeze/oil oozed out from the plug hole. We checked the oil again, and found the same coolant/oil on the stick. There is oil in the coolant reservoir too (though it's been like that for over 6 months). Other than there is a head gasket issue, I can't quite make sense of everything. My best guess is upon that first start up, the head gasket went out, that cylinder suck some antifreeze, which was too much compression, so it blew out the rings, and the awful knocking we hear is the piston just loose in the cylinder. Why these same things were heard over a month ago, but then went away I can't figure out. Any thoughts as to what's going on. Thanks a bunch.

Scrapper
05-17-2011, 10:38 AM
Okay, so over a month ago I went to start up my 99 Windstar for the first time that morning. It turned over, made some clanking racket, and then locked up. Tried to start it again, and it just made a clicking noise, like a solenoid engaging. I kept trying, and it only made that clink noise. I checked the oil, and it was barely on the stick ( i know that was my fault for not checking it for a while). I added the only oil I had, which was less than a quart, and then it's started right up, and has driven like a champ for the last month. This last week however, I went to start it up on morning, and I got that same clink noise, but no clanking racket. I though maybe the battery was just low, and tried jumping it, but still clink. Bought a new (not refurbished) starter, and it still made the clink noise. Checked the oil, and it was fine. Bench tested old starter, and it was fine. But old starter back on, and cleaned all power and ground cables at both ends, and still just a clink. So I ran jump cables to the starter from the battery, so as to bypass all normal cables. Clinked the first try, but then it turned over. But when it turned over, at had this awful, loud, knocking noise that sounded like that one time a month ago but the motor didn't lock up. The knocking followed the RPMs, and seemed to come from around the starter area. We shut it off right away, and spent the next two days messing with the starter, flexplate, and torque converter, and all seemed fine. We did a compression test just to see if perhaps it was in fact the dreaded rod knock. We did for cylinders, and when we pulled the spark plug on the 5th, antifreeze/oil oozed out from the plug hole. We checked the oil again, and found the same coolant/oil on the stick. There is oil in the coolant reservoir too (though it's been like that for over 6 months). Other than there is a head gasket issue, I can't quite make sense of everything. My best guess is upon that first start up, the head gasket went out, that cylinder suck some antifreeze, which was too much compression, so it blew out the rings, and the awful knocking we hear is the piston just loose in the cylinder. Why these same things were heard over a month ago, but then went away I can't figure out. Any thoughts as to what's going on. Thanks a bunch.

well with antifrezze in oil sounds like leaky head gasket or warped head what did the comp test show you?

jcatalanello
05-17-2011, 10:49 AM
Well, the compression was fine on the other cylinders, but we didn't test that one with the sludge, because we weren't sure if it would screw up our gauge, esp since it was borrowed.

tomj76
05-17-2011, 06:11 PM
You may need to remove the oil pan and inspect the connecting rods. Big job, but if you had enough liquid in the cylinder to fill the combustion chamber (the volume left after the compression stroke), then you could have bent (or broken) the connecting rod, which would be the source of the noise.

Also, the leak could have been from the lower intake manifold gasket. There are water passages from the heads to the lower intake, and leaks can lead to coolant in the oil, and visa versa.

jcatalanello
05-17-2011, 10:18 PM
Sounds very possible. I know my lower intake manifold has been leaking oil since I've owned, it, but I was told not to worry about it. I still haven't looked to see where oil and coolant pass through the manifold, and I don't understand why it would. If that's the case, did the coolant come into the combustion chamber through the intake valve? And be "connection rod" I am assuming you are referring to the piston rod? And would a bent rod make all that racket? And still, I can't figure out what would have happened a month ago when it made the same noise, and then stopped. Thanks for the input, gives me something else to chew on.

Scrapper
05-18-2011, 03:06 PM
when it goes click try to turn harmotic balance with socket and make sure key is off to just be on safe side. because i'm thinking you tryed to start it after setting that long witch will lock it up may only be one or two cyls if it don't turn over by turning balancer.

jcatalanello
05-19-2011, 05:55 PM
Scrapper,
Well, I am not sure what the balancer is, but the engine turns over when you start it. It's not going click anymore. I appreciate your input, but I am not sure if we're on the same page.

olopezm
05-19-2011, 06:13 PM
The harmonic balancer which Scrapper refers to is also known as the crank pulley, normally the biggest of all ;)

Oscar.

tempfixit
05-19-2011, 06:54 PM
Picture of crankshaft balancer:

http://repairguide.autozone.com/znetrgs/repair_guide_content/en_us/images/0996b43f/80/21/bb/5e/small/0996b43f8021bb5e.jpg

Scrapper
05-20-2011, 07:03 PM
Scrapper,
Well, I am not sure what the balancer is, but the engine turns over when you start it. It's not going click anymore. I appreciate your input, but I am not sure if we're on the same page.

well the balancer knocks loud when it goes bad it was just a thought but the oil you said was very low so engine may be shot hope not though? and you say you done a comp test except the one that was fowled out so i'm with the other guy now on being a rod thants for your reply.

good luck..

jcatalanello
05-20-2011, 11:22 PM
Okay, so what it's sounding like is, I sucked enough fluid into the chamber, hydrolocked itand so all I could hear is the click of the solenoid engaging, and for some reason as soon as it finally had enough guts to turn the motor over, that it sucked more fluid, which was too much compression on the running motor, and it bent the piston rod on that piston. But how does a bent rod cause knocking, and how would the coolant end up in my oil pan?

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